Posted on 11/06/2011 6:11:04 AM PST by pastorbillrandles
This is the mistake the Rob Bell crowd makes in their "God is love" analysis. They use that verse to validate defining God by their subjective opinions as to what love is. The verse, however, tells us we must define love by what the objective revelation of scripture tells us about God.
Good word again from Bill......thanks....
Once you start making up your own religions - like the heretics of the ‘reformation’- there are really no rules.
Paul warned us about this - “I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought. My brothers, some from Chloe's household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What I mean is this: One of you says, "I follow Paul"; another, "I follow Apollos"; another, "I follow Cephas"; still another, "I follow Christ."
You could easily read the above as “One of you says, "I follow Luther"; another, "I follow Calvin"; another, "I follow Wesley"; still another, "I follow Christ."
Christians cannot be “perfectly united in mind and thought” when they have different beliefs on, say, the necessity of water baptism, while others believe “This is my Body” means “This is a cookie”
Fortunately, we have Christ’s promise that heresies will never prevail against His Church. They will arise, endure sometimes for centuries, like Protestantism, but we can be confident in Christ’s promise that the Church will always teach the Truth.
Looking forward to part II.
Or you could read it as the Catholic inquisition saying, "I murdered Huss"; another, "I murdered Tyndale" or others; "We slaughtered the Waldensians", or "We tortured Jews to death in Spain", etc. etc. Some unity.
Rob Bell is merely a regurgitation of John Shelby Spong.
There is nothing new under the sun.
I agree with you, although it is novel that now a Spong wannabe has a constituency among confessing evangelicals-
Nice!
It’s good to hear the arrogant rantings of “The One Superior Church” to slam other Christian religions. There is a One True God and there are true believers but to believe that the Catholic church has a lock on anything superior is a stretch I can’t believe. The Catholic Church has as many faults as the rest of them but it is their unwillingness to admit such that is probably the most egregious.
Promising perdition ping
All men have sinned - we know that. But we also know from Scripture that the basic premise of “Protestantism” cannot be true.
“Careful to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. One body and one Spirit: as you are called in one hope of your calling. One Lord, one faith, one baptism.” Eph 4:3-5
The Church is to be one, not many.
“And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” Mat 6:18
Here Christ says his Church will not be destroyed.
“I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.” John 16:12-13
“But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.” 1Tim 3:15
Here Christ says, and Paul reaffirms, that the Church will always teach the TRUTH.
"Then Jesus came to them and said, 'All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.'"Mat 28:18-20
Again, here Jesus assures us that He is always with us, to the very end.
So Christ says His Church will not be destroyed or fall away from him, that the Holy Spirit will guide the Church to always teach the Truth, and He will always be with us. If there are “many” Churches Christ is a liar.
There has to be more than that, for Scripture to be true.
How would you make sense of the following?
"If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over. But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that 'every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.' If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector. "I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. Mat 81:15-18
Where do you take your concerns? To which 'body of belivers?' Makes no sense whatsoever without the visible Church Christ established with teaching authority, and the power to loose and bind. People who call themselves Christians can’t even agree on what the meaning of the word “is” is.
The Church of the apostles was definitely one: "There is one body and one spirit," Paul wrote, "just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of us all" (Eph. 4:4-5). Paul linked this unity to the Church's common Eucharistic bread: "Because there is one bread, we who are many are one body, for we all partake of one bread" (1 Cor. 10:17). Jesus had promised at the outset that "there would be one flock, one shepherd" (John 10:16).
Think about it. Would Christ establish his Church – to teach the way, the truth – and allow thousands of interpretation as to what is the truth? If the Church doesn’t teach the Truth, Christ is a liar. If He would allow multiple versions of Truth, he’d be an idiot. I don’t believe He is either.
So what is it? The body of Christ as He was in the flesh here on earth or the body of Christ’s transfigured perfected body as He is in heaven?
Nice you could find those verses proving your point. Maybe you could find the verse that proves the bodily assumption of Mary for me?
??? This is circular reasoning. “I believe Luther taught the truth, so since the Church doesn’t accept Luther, the Church is false.” You could make the same argument for the Mormons, or Islam.
But that is not what Christ said about His Church.
However, Luther was not wrong about everything:
"Who, but the devil, has granted such license of wresting the words of the holy Scripture? Who ever read in the Scriptures, that my body is the same as the sign of my body? or, that is is the same as it signifies? What language in the world ever spoke so? It is only then the devil, that imposes upon us by these fanatical men. Not one of the Fathers of the Church, though so numerous, ever spoke as the Sacramentarians: not one of them ever said, It is only bread and wine; or, the body and blood of Christ is not there present.
Surely, it is not credible, nor possible, since they often speak, and repeat their sentiments, that they should never (if they thought so) not so much as once, say, or let slip these words: It is bread only; or the body of Christ is not there, especially it being of great importance, that men should not be deceived. Certainly, in so many Fathers, and in so many writings, the negative might at least be found in one of them, had they thought the body and blood of Christ were not really present: but they are all of them unanimous.” –Luther’s Collected Works, Wittenburg Edition, no. 7 p, 391
So Martin Luther says only the devil believes the bread is only bread.
Where would he get such an idea? From Christ Himself!
First, answer a couple easy questions:
1) Where did Jesus give instructions that the Christian faith should be based exclusively on a book?
2) Other than the specific command to John to pen the Revelation, where did Jesus tell His apostles to write anything down and compile it into an authoritative book?
3) Where in the New Testament do the apostles tell future generations that the Christian faith will be based solely on a book?
4) Where in the Bible do we find an inspired and infallible list of books that should belong in the Bible? Where did the table of contents come from?
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