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To: kearnyirish2; yefragetuwrabrumuy

I agree with kearnyirish2. Unless we’re Marxists and believe that anonymous economic forces control us all, we have no reason to attribute fewer marriages (and fewer children) to anything but active personal choice.

Weddings don’t have to be expensive. A Catholic wedding requires: a man and woman free to marry; a priest or deacon; two independent witnesses; a church. That could be you and your intended, your pastor, the secretary, and the custodian standing in the back of the church (or even in the office, depending on where it’s located). Costs less than a tank of gas.

People don’t have to choose consumer goods over children. Encouraging couples to believe that they’re the victims of random economic or cultural determinants, instead of agents making decisions, encourages them to be useless in every area of life. Something I do for my children, as my mother did for me, is to force them to make statements that take responsibility: statements that start, “I decided to ...,” or “I put myself in a position where ...”, rather than “I didn’t have a chance to,” or “I didn’t have any other choice.”


18 posted on 06/28/2011 5:36:20 AM PDT by Tax-chick (I should be, but I'm not.)
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To: Tax-chick

I’m not blaming the church one bit.

You wrote: “A Catholic wedding requires: a man and woman free to marry; a priest or deacon; two independent witnesses; a church.”

But you might have as well written “a man and a woman, both Catholic orphans no longer living with their adoptive parents, who no longer take an interest in their children’s lives...”

It’s contradictory to think that “good” Catholic parents, who have had an important hand in raising their children, shepherding through Baptism and Confirmation, and at least weekly church services, are somehow going to say, “Have a nice marriage! Your mother and I will be at home watching TV.”

And unlike their parents, who were probably broke when they were married, and had to scrimp and save to prosper; kids today are deeply in debt, having to pay off bloated student loans, years or a decade or more before they can hit the enviable position of “broke”.

“But your mother and I were planning to spend at least $30,000 on your wedding!”


19 posted on 06/28/2011 7:35:00 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: Tax-chick

Thanks; you state it well that our choices more than anything else are causing this.

My sister recently gave me an older car she was replacing; it is now 14 years old (running reasonably well), and is the first car I’ve ever owned that only used one key (my four previous cars had separate keys for the doors & ignition). I felt lucky to get it, as the ‘93 Chrysler I was driving would never pass inspection, and it was due (head gasket was going). I always knew from the moment my wife and I started having children that I would never have a newer car or a nice home (I come from a large family), and that turned out to be correct; we have three now and the chance of having either is even more remote.

As we get older, we see a lot of people we know who chose otherwise are starting to regret their decisions, especially as they reach the age where the women would have difficulty bearing a child. They feel excluded from any conversations about children, and tend to cluster with other cat/dog people.


32 posted on 06/28/2011 5:17:29 PM PDT by kearnyirish2
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To: Tax-chick; kearnyirish2
People don’t have to choose consumer goods over children.

Exactamundo!!

When i helped in India I saw families that sacrificed a lot for their kids.

I don't need that new car or new clothes -- I can shop at the second-hand stores if I want something new for daily wear, etc. etc.

I admire kearnyirish2 for his choices and I think those were the right ones.

44 posted on 06/30/2011 5:12:58 AM PDT by Cronos ( W Szczebrzeszynie chrzaszcz brzmi w trzcinie I Szczebrzeszyn z tego slynie.)
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