What Does the Bible Say About Honesty? [Ecumenical]

AssociatedContent.com ^ | not given | Lee Andrew Henderson

[ADSUM]

I disagree on the need to repent for a lie to protect others based on your intent to do the right thing.

Life is full of choices, and sometimes one needs to fight by rules established by the situation, whether it is queensberry rules or street fighting.

I agree that Honesty is the best way.

The TRUTH will eventually prevail as Christ is the TRUTH and the LIGHT.

[ADSUM]

Luke 16:10
Whoever can be trusted with very little can also be trusted with much, and whoever is dishonest with very little will also be dishonest with much.

[Cronos]

Perhaps you're right -- as I said, it's my opinion on that and I'm open to changing my opinion.

But I don't understand your point -- do you mean to say we shouldn't repent or that we don't need to repent for say "lying to Nutzis that there are Jews hiding in my attic"

It's a very difficult question, no doubt.

Can you imagine being in that position? How many of us have really faced being physically persecuted for our faith?

in the Nutzi example -- the one that moves me the most is the story of Janusz Korczak, a man who loved orphans and set up an orphanage in Warsaw. When the Nutzis took them to the gas chambers, they gave him the option to stay out as he was famous enough for there to be a stink. He refused and went into the gas chambers to keep their spirits up. Now that is a hero

[ADSUM]

1 John 2:20-21
But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth.

[investigateworld]

Man, what a tear jerker.

[Cronos]

it is — and I didn’t even say it very well. This man was a saint of the utmost degree. Whether Jewish, Catholic , Protestant or Orthodox, that is irrelevant.

[ADSUM]

Evil acts or sin can be committed by commission or omission.

In this case, one can do nothing and let the evil acts be done by others. Or, one could lie to protect the lives of others and put oneself at risk.

Does this action bring one closer to God or away from him?

My feeling is that it was morally the right thing to do and would bring one closer to God.

Regarding being physically persecuted for our faith, I would hope that based on my beliefs that it would be easier to die for God and my belief in Him than to do all the things that I should be doing now.

I am concerned and pray for the Catholics and non Catholics in the Middle East. I do not understand why people can be so mean, hateful and harmful to others.

[ADSUM]

Colossians 3:9-10
Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator.

[investigateworld]

Corrie Ten Boom did some great writing about hiding Jews in Holland during WW2.

Some of their efforts included flat out lying to the Gestapo!

[ADSUM]

Even Pope Pius XII was quitely helping. Remember that six million Jews and three million Catholics were killed in the Holocaust.

The Israeli consul, Pinchas E. Lapide, in his book, Three Popes and the Jews (New York: Hawthorn Books, Inc., 1967) critically examines Pope Pius XII. According to his research, the Catholic Church under Pius XII was instrumental in saving 860,000 Jews from Nazi death camps (p. 214). Could Pius have saved more lives by speaking out more forcefully? According to Lapide, the concentration camp prisoners did not want Pius to speak out openly (p. 247). As one jurist from the Nuremberg Trials said on WNBC in New York (Feb. 28, 1964), “Any words of Pius XII, directed against a madman like Hitler, would have brought on an even worse catastrophe... [and] accelerated the massacre of Jews and priests.” (Ibid.) Yet Pius was not totally silent either. Lapide notes a book by the Jewish historian, Jenoe Levai, entitled, The Church Did Not Keep Silent (p. 256). He admits that everyone, including himself, could have done more. If we condemn Pius, then justice would demand condemning everyone else. He concludes by quoting from the Talmud that “whosoever preserves one life, it is accounted to him by Scripture as if he had preserved a whole world.” With this he claims that Pius XII deserves a memorial forest of 860,000 trees in the Judean hills (pp. 268-9). It should be noted that six million Jews and three million Catholics were killed in the Holocaust.

We must remember that the Holocaust was also anti-Christian. After Hitler revealed his true intentions, the Catholic Church opposed him. Even the famous Albert Einstein testified to that.

[investigateworld]

I agree. The one thing I'm certain of; he wasn't a Seventh Day Adventist. When one reads about their cooperation with the NAZIS during WWII? Enough to make you sick.Yet they call the Catholic 'The Whole of Babylon? ... These pimps to the NAZIs have some nerve!!!!

They even dis-fellowshipped their Jewish converts.

[investigateworld]

Now I’m in a funk .... just the thought of the killing a child. Too bad St.Vincent de Paul doesn’t carry guns. (Ya, guys need to do a little shopping to cheer themselves up)

[Salvation]

There is always another choice — rather than lying about things.

It’s called SILENCE!

We are called forth, however, to stand up for God at all times.

[Salvation]

Leviticus 6:2 tells that an honest person does not cheat.

[Salvation]

both Phillippians 4:8 and Romans 12:1-2 we are told that honesty takes training and habit and a matter of will.

[investigateworld]

Funny, I was just cruising the Willamett Weekly blog. Guess what their number one story is? "Staff at Adventist Medical Center refused to leave ER to help a man having a heart attack in the parking lot. Turns out the police and fire department were there, but the ER staff wanted the pt. to come in via Ambulance".

These people aren't stupid, they're evil!!!

[investigateworld]

"... a honest person does not cheat..."

One of my secretes in the construction biz was to never hire a sub-contractor who cheated on his wife. While I don't see myself as some kind 'morals enforcer', it's just that if a man will cheat on his wife, he'll have no problem lying or cheating me.

(I was able to retire at age 46, so I did something right)

[johngrace]

Wow! That’s some story!

[One Name]

Thank you!

That is by far the most head-on exposition of that issue I’ve ever heard. It makes perfect sense.

Believers should always strive to find a way to do God’s will without lying. It is an option that is always open to evildoers, for evil purposes. For God’s people it is an option of last resort, for good purpose. But, in this case and others (like hiding Jews in the attic) it was not for an evil purpose, and no other option appeared to avoid it.

I appreciate your response. God Bless.

[One Name]

Thanks for your responses- I had to retire last night.

In the prison business in the course of unwinding inmate subversion we had to mislead (lie) frequently, misdirect, protect informants, etc.

I always thought we were 1: doing it for the right reason (security,peace, defusing situations) 2: trying to protect or prevent violence, especially against staff or those inmates helping us, but even to protect the evildoers from harm.