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To: Sherman Logan; Elsie

Show us one example from the Bible (or History) where an actual Martyr fought back.

C’mon we are waiting.

Martyrs don’t fight back, Smith died in a gunfight caused by his own arrogance and vandalism. That is not a martyr.


829 posted on 01/03/2011 1:16:47 PM PST by reaganaut (Ex Mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: reaganaut

I never said he was a martyr, because I didn’t disclose my definition of the term.

It was entirely appropriate for Joe to fight back. The mob that came to kill him had no legal authority and was in fact violating a guarantee of safety by the governor. They were a gang of murderers, and I don’t believe anything Christ said could be construed to mean that a Christian was not supposed to defend himsel against murderers.

As far as History goes, it depends on your definition of martyr, as I said initially. But a good many Catholics (and Protestants) consider many of those who were killed by the other side during the various religious wars of early modeern times to have been martyrs. A good many of these people were captured while in arms against their foes before their murders.


886 posted on 01/03/2011 1:45:54 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: reaganaut
Martyrs don't fight back.

From Foxe's Book of Martyrs: "Hermenigildus, a Gothic prince, was the eldest son of Leovigildus, a king of the Goths, in Spain. This prince, who was originally an Arian, became a convert to the orthodox faith, by means of his wife Ingonda. When the king heard that his son had changed his religious sentiments, he stripped him of the command at Seville, where he was governor, and threatened to put him to death unless he renounced the faith he had newly embraced. The prince, in order to prevent the execution of his father's menaces, began to put himself into a posture of defence; and many of the orthodox persuasion in Spain declared for him. The king, exasperated at this act of rebellion, began to punish all the orthodox Christians who could be seized by his troops, and thus a very severe persecution commenced: he likewise marched against his son at the head of a very powerful army. The prince took refuge in Seville, from which he fled, and was at length besieged and taken at Asieta. Loaded with chains, he was sent to Seville, and at the feast of Easter refusing to receive the Eucharist from an Arian bishop, the enraged king ordered his guards to cut the prince to pieces, which they punctually performed, April 13, A.D. 586."

926 posted on 01/03/2011 2:07:21 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: reaganaut; Sherman Logan
Show us one example from the Bible (or History) where an actual Martyr fought back.

C’mon we are waiting.

Martyrs don’t fight back, Smith died in a gunfight caused by his own arrogance and vandalism. That is not a martyr.


 


 
"Joseph; I advise you not to go to that jail."
 
"Darn gnats!!"
 
 
"Joseph; I'm telling you to not to go to that jail."
 
"Flies are BAD today!!"
 
 
"Joseph; It ain't gonna be pretty if you ignore me and go to that jail!"
 
"Crummy mosquitos are EVERYWHERE!!!"
 
 
"Joseph!  Do NOT go to that jail!"
 
"And those bedbugs really savaged me last night, too!"
 
 
"JOSEPH!!  Wake up boy!   Do Not Go To That JAIL!!!"
 
"All right Sheriff - here I am, so give me a nice room while my Lawyer, my Advocate, my Comforter presents the LAW to the Judge and I am VINDICATED!!!"
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

1,178 posted on 01/03/2011 7:04:44 PM PST by Elsie
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