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What Educated Non-Muslims Don't Like About Islam in a Nutshell
Citizen Warrior ^ | 09/01/2010 | Citizen Warrior

Posted on 10/17/2010 8:57:39 PM PDT by Lloyd227

What Educated Non-Muslims Don't Like About Islam in a Nutshell

Wednesday, September 1

#fullpost{display:inline;} altTHE QURAN is Islam's most holy book. Sixty-one percent of the Quran is about non-Muslims. Writings about what Muslims should do is religious. Writings about what non-Muslims should do or how Muslims should deal with non-Muslims is political (read more about this). Therefore, based on Islam's most holy book, Islam is more political (61%) than religious (39%).

There are 245 verses in the Quran that could be considered "positive verses" about non-Muslims. Every single one of those verses have been abrogated by later, negative verses about non-Muslims. Not one positive verse about non-Muslims is left.

In contrast, there are 527 verses of intolerance toward non-Muslims, and 109 verses specifically advocating violence towards non-Muslims. Not one of these verses has been abrogated.

My conclusion: Non-Muslims who like Islam don't know much about it.

TOPICS: General Discusssion; History; Islam; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: islam; muslim; religionofpeace; rop
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Good information over at Citizen Warrior, worth checking out his other information.
1 posted on 10/17/2010 8:57:43 PM PDT by Lloyd227
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To: Lloyd227

They’ve nailed it. Everytime you hear some liberal (or conservative for that matter) idiot spouting off about the ‘peacefulness’ of Islam needs to be told that all of those peaceful verse HAVE BEEN ABROGATED!

For those of you who don’t understand what abrogated means, it means they’ve been replaced by the violent verses.

2 posted on 10/17/2010 9:06:28 PM PDT by conservativegramma
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To: Lloyd227

bookmark - this looks very interesting!

3 posted on 10/17/2010 9:11:29 PM PDT by fightinJAG (Step away from the toilet. Let the housing market flush.)
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To: conservativegramma
I only discovered this Citizen Warrior site a few hours ago and it's filled with very good information. Presented well, easy to follow and easy to understand.

And with links to more detailed follow up information if you're ready for it.

Great resource!!

4 posted on 10/17/2010 9:14:10 PM PDT by Lloyd227 (Class of 1998 (let's all help the Team McCain spider monkeys decide how to moderate))
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To: Lloyd227

5 posted on 10/17/2010 9:16:26 PM PDT by wastedyears (Know this, I will return to this land... rebuild where the ruins did stand)
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To: conservativegramma

Later verses of the koran replace earlier verses.

As MadMo aged, he became more violent and the Koran reflects his increasing psychosis.

Islam Delenda Est - because Islam forces us to.

6 posted on 10/17/2010 9:18:29 PM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is essential to examine principles,)
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To: Lloyd227

only need 2 words to explain the headline.....their nuts..

7 posted on 10/17/2010 9:19:13 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: Lloyd227


8 posted on 10/17/2010 9:24:50 PM PDT by Sergio (If a tree fell on a mime in the forest, would he make a sound?)
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To: GladesGuru
Another interesting exercise in compare and contrast is to compare the final hours of Jesus on earth to the final hours of MadMo as recorded in the Koran.

As anyone who reads the New Testament knows, the major concerns of Jesus were the care of his aged mother, the welfare of his apostles and the preaching of his Gospel. IOW, everything Christ did in his final hours showed humility and concern for others.

MadMo, on the other hand, was concerned about his finances and what people would think of him. And while it is commendable to want to make sure your debts are paid off before you die, I get the definite idea in reading the Koran that MadMo would have had anyone beheaded, a practice he and his subsequent followers are very fond of, had they actually presented a claim for payment in MadMo's final hours.

9 posted on 10/17/2010 9:36:07 PM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: All
. . 109 verses specifically advocating violence towards non-Muslims. . Doesn't that say it all?

We are at War with Islam!

10 posted on 10/17/2010 9:36:49 PM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: Lloyd227
From the article...
"The Quran itself explains what to do with conflicting verses. If two passages conflict, it says, the one written later is better than the one written earlier. The earlier passage has been abrogated by the later one."

THIS RIGHT HERE is all you need to know about the Koran/Quran/whatever. It proves itself to be less than holy. It is not given by God or Allah or whatever your name is for the Almighty. It cannot be if (a) there are errors; (b) if there is conflict; and (c) especially if there's a clause that basically has God saying to us "Hey, if I made a mistake along the way, don't worry about it -- I'll fix it in my next draft."

How can reasonable people possibly accept such a premise??

11 posted on 10/17/2010 9:38:58 PM PDT by alancarp (Please don't tell Obama what comes after "trillion")
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To: Lloyd227
What UNEducated Non-Muslims Don't Like About Islam in a Nutshell

12 posted on 10/17/2010 9:41:32 PM PDT by MestaMachine
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To: goat granny

“only need 2 words to explain the headline.....their nuts..”

Their nuts is the objective.

They are nuts is their condition.


13 posted on 10/17/2010 9:46:36 PM PDT by Psalm 144
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To: Lloyd227

Here is something educated and uneducated Americans should consider, the Muslim Brotherhood’s ahead of schedule agenda discovered in 1991:

Islamic invasion of America: The 20 Point Plan

This sums up the Muslim Brotherfood project in America quite succinctly. On November 7, 2001 international law enforcement authorities and Western intelligence agencies discovered a twenty-year old document revealing a top-secret plan developed by the oldest Islamist organization with one of the most extensive terror networks in the world to launch a program of “cultural invasion” and eventual conquest of the West that virtually mirrors the tactics used by Islamists for more than two decades.

Since that time information about this document, known in counterterrorism circles as “The Project”, and discussion regarding its content has been limited to the top-secret world of Western intelligence communities. Only through the work of an intrepid Swiss journalist, Sylvain Besson of Le Temps, and his book published in October 2005 in France, La conquête de l’Occident: Le projet secret des Islamistes (The Conquest of the West: The Islamists’ Secret Project), has information regarding The Project finally been made public. One Western official cited by Besson has described The Project as “a totalitarian ideology of infiltration which represents, in the end, the greatest danger for European societies.”


Included in the documents seized during the raid of Nada’s Swiss villa was a 14-page plan written in Arabic and dated December 1, 1982, which outlines a 12-point strategy to “establish an Islamic government on earth” – identified as The Project. According to testimony given to Swiss authorities by Nada, the unsigned document was prepared by “Islamic researchers” associated with the Muslim Brotherhood.

If you want to read more of the Muslim Brotherhood project go here.

U.S. Arab-American author outlines secret 20-year strategy to undermine countryWND
A refugee from the Muslim Middle East thinks he has discovered Islam’s 20-point plan for conquering the United States by 2020 >

Anis Shorrosh, author of ‘’Islam Revealed’’ and ‘’The True Furqan,’’ is a Christian Arab-American who emigrated from Arab-controlled Jerusalem in January 1967.

‘’The following is my analysis of Islamic invasion of America, the agenda of Islamists and visible methods to take over America by the year 2020,’’ Shorrosh says. ‘’Will Americans continue to sleep through this invasion as they did when we were attacked on 9/11?’’

1. Terminate America’s freedom of speech by replacing it with statewide and nationwide hate-crime bills.

2. Wage a war of words using black leaders like Louis Farrakhan, Rev. Jesse Jackson and other visible religious personalities who promote Islam as the religion of African-Americans while insisting Christianity is for whites only. What they fail to tell African-Americans is that it was Arab Muslims who captured them and sold them as slaves. In fact, the Arabic word for black and slave is the same, ‘’Abed.’’

3. Engage the American public in dialogues, discussions, debates in colleges, universities, public libraries, radio, TV, churches and mosques on the virtues of Islam. Proclaim how it is historically another religion like Judaism and Christianity with the same monotheistic faith.

4. Nominate Muslim sympathizers to political office to bring about favorable legislation toward Islam and support potential sympathizers by block voting.

5. Take control of as much of Hollywood, the press, TV, radio and the Internet as possible by buying the related corportations or a controlling stock.

6. Yield to the fear of the imminent shut-off of the lifeblood of America – black gold. America’s economy depends on oil and 41 percent of it comes from the Middle East.

7. Yell ‘’foul, out-of-context, personal interpretation, hate crime, Zionist, un- American, inaccurate interpretation of the Quran’’ anytime Islam is criticized or the Quran is analyzed in the public arena.

8. Encourage Muslims to penetrate the White House, specifically with Islamists who can articulate a marvelous and peaceful picture of Islam. Acquire government positions and get membership in local school boards. Train Muslims a medical doctors to dominate the medical field, research and pharmaceutical l companies (Ever notice how numerous Muslim doctors in America are, when their countries need them more desperately than America?) Take over the computer industry. Establish Middle Eastern restaurants throughout the U.S. to connect planners of Islamization in a discreet way.

9. Accelerate Islamic demographic growth via:

* Massive immigration (100,000 annually since 1961).

* Use no birth control whatsoever – every baby of Muslim parents is automatically a Muslim and cannot choose another religion later.

* Muslim men must marry American women and Islamize them (10,000 annually). Then divorce them and remarry every five years – since one can’t legally marry four at one time. This is a legal solution in America.

* Convert angry, alienated black inmates and turn them into militants (so far 2,000 released inmates have joined al-Qaida worldwide). Only a few ‘’sleeper cells’’ have been captured in Afghanistan and on American soil.

10. Reading, writing, arithmetic and research through the American educational system, mosques and student centers (now 1,500) should be sprinkled with dislike of Jews, evangelical Christians and democracy. There are currently 300 exclusively Muslim schools in the U.S. which teach loyalty to the Quran, not the U.S. Constitution. In January of 2002, Saudi Arabia’s Embassy in Washington mailed 4,500 packets of the Quran and videos promoting Islam to America’s high schools – free of charge. Saudi Arabia would not allow the U.S. to reciprocate.

11. Provide very sizeable monetary Muslim grants to colleges and universities in America to establish ‘’Centers for Islamic studies’’ with Muslim directors to promote Islam in higher-education institutions.

12. Let the entire world know through propaganda, speeches, seminars, local and national media that terrorists have hijacked Islam, when in truth, Islam hijacked the terrorists.

13. Appeal to the historically compassionate and sensitive Americans for sympathy and tolerance towards Muslims in America who are portrayed as mainly immigrants from oppressed countries.

14. Nullify America’s sense of security by manipulating the intelligence community with misinformation. Periodically terrorize Americans with reports of impending attacks on bridges, tunnels, water supplies, airports, apartment buildings and malls.

15. Form riots and demonstrations in the prison system demanding Islamic Sharia as the way of life, not America’s justice system.

16. Open numerous charities throughout the U.S., but use the funds to support Islamic terrorism with American dollars.

17. Raise interest in Islam on America’s campuses by insisting freshman take at least one course on Islam.

18. Unify the numerous Muslim lobbies in Washington, mosques, Islamic student centers, educational organizations, magazines and papers by Internet and an annual convention to coordinate plans, propagate the faith and engender news in the media.

19. Send intimidating messages and messengers
to the outspoken individuals who are critical of Islam and seek to eliminate them by hook or crook.

20. Applaud Muslims as loyal citizens of the U.S. by spotlighting their voting record as the highest percentage of all minority and ethic groups in America.

AND, unnoticed like Bin Laden’s declaration of war on the US in 1996, the MB has declared war on the US in the last few weeks...Rubin’s article on the matter:

The Region: The declaration of war that went unnoticed
10/10/2010 23:29

The Muslim Brotherhood recently called for jihad on the US and Israel, adopting a view almost identical to al-Qaida’s.
Talkbacks (1)

Here’s something important: The Muslim Brotherhood’s leader has endorsed anti-American jihad and a view virtually identical to al-Qaida’s ideology. Since the Brotherhood is the main opposition in Egypt and Jordan and the most powerful group in Muslim communities of Europe and North America, this is serious stuff.

Does that mean all these branches are going to launch terror attacks, as one affiliate, Hamas, has long done? Not necessarily.

Egyptian TV show stirs debate over Muslim Brotherhood
The Region: An offer he had to refuse

But hundreds of thousands of Brotherhood followers are being given a signal. Some will engage in terrorism; others will redouble efforts to seize control of countries and turn them into bases for war on the West.

The Brotherhood is the group that often dominates Muslim communities and runs mosques in the West. Its front groups are often courted by Western governments and media.

Yet here is the Brotherhood’s new supreme guide, Muhammad Badi giving a sermon entitled, “How Islam Confronts the Oppression and Tyranny,” translated by MEMRI in which he says:

• Arab and Muslim regimes betray their people unless they confront not only Israel but also the US. Waging jihad against both is mandatory for all Muslims. Otherwise, “They are disregarding Allah’s commandment to wage jihad... so that Allah’s word will reign supreme” over all non-Muslims.

• All Muslims are required by their religion to fight as their highest priority, since “the improvement and change that the [Muslim] nation seeks can only be attained through jihad and sacrifice, and by raising a jihadi generation that pursues death just as its enemies pursue life.”

• The US is easy to defeat through violence, since it is “experiencing the beginning of its end and is heading toward its demise.”

• Palestinians should back Hamas in overthrowing the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank and unite in waging war on Israel.

• Rational calculations applied by the West to adversaries, assuming Muslims won’t act in a revolutionary and even suicidal manner, want a better future for their children, etc., don’t apply to the Islamist movement: “Allah said: ‘The hosts will all be routed and will turn and flee’ (Koran 54:45). This verse is a promise to the believers that they shall defeat their enemies... and that through Allah you shall triumph... The outcome of the confrontation has been predetermined by Allah.”

Thus, it doesn’t matter how long the battle lasts or its cost in destruction and death, you should go on fighting.

IN THE real world, Islamists are unlikely to win over, say, 50 or 100 years. But those views mean these 50 or 100 years are going to be filled with instability and bloodshed. Muslims don’t have to agree with Badi’s views, yet hundreds of thousands will, and millions will cheer them.

There’s even more food for thought in Badi’s speech.

“Resistance is the only solution... The United States cannot impose an agreement upon the Palestinians, despite all the power at its disposal. [Today] it is withdrawing from Iraq, defeated and wounded, and is also on the verge of withdrawing from Afghanistan” because it has been defeated by Islamist warriors.

First, US efforts that seem to be succeeding at brokering Israel-Palestinian peace would only spark more violence, not less, as Islamists seek to defeat them. Desirable as peace or even progress toward peace might be, the West should have no illusions about those things providing regional stability; they will produce more instability.

Second, US apologies, concessions and withdrawals are interpreted by Islamists and many in the Middle East as signs of weakness, which spark further aggression and violence.

Note that it is precisely fear of a tough opponent thet keeps Badi from saying anything about fighting Egypt’s government, which won’t hesitate to throw Brotherhood leaders in prison and even torture them.

STILL, THE coming leadership transition in Egypt, with the death or retirement of President Husni Mubarak, seems to offer opportunities. The new harder line coincides with the Brotherhood’s announcement that it will run candidates in the November elections – another sign of its confidence and increased militancy.

The Brotherhood is not a legal group, but the government lets members run in other parties. Its candidates won about 20 percent of the vote in the last elections – especially impressive given the regime’s repressive measures. If the Brotherhood intends to defy Egyptian law now, there will be confrontations, mass arrests and perhaps violence.

Most important, however, Badi and many others sense weakness on the part of the West, especially the US leaders, and victory for the Islamists.

Even former British prime minister Tony Blair is warning about such things. Blair comes from the British Labor Party. Many conservatives understand these issues. But the West can never respond successfully without a broader consensus about the nature of the threat and the need for a strong response. Where are Blair’s counterparts in the left-of-center forces in North America, the kind of people who played such a critical role in confronting and defeating the previous wave of anti-democratic extremism, communism?

This new hard line signals:

1. Increased internal conflict in Egypt, the start of a decade-long struggle for power in the Arabic-speaking world’s most important country.

2. The likelihood that more Brotherhood supporters in the West will turn to violence and fund-raising for terrorism.

3. The true nature of the radical indoctrination – preparing people for future extremism and terrorism – in the mosques and groups they control.

4. A probable upturn in anti-American terrorist attacks in the Middle East and Europe.

In August 1996, al-Qaida declared war on America, the West, Christians and Jews. Nobody important paid much attention. Almost exactly five years later, September 11 forced them to notice. Let it be said that in September 2010 the Muslim Brotherhood, a group with 100 times more activists than al-Qaida, issued its declaration of war. What remains is the history of the future.

The writer is director of the Global Research in International Affairs Center and editor of Middle East Review of International Affairs and Turkish Studies. He blogs at

14 posted on 10/17/2010 9:47:33 PM PDT by givemELL (Does Taiwan eet the Criteria to Qualify as an "Overseas Territory of the United States"? by Richar)
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To: alancarp
Furthermore about abrogation, the article cites this as one of the establishment verses for abrogation:

"2:106 "Whatever of Our revelations We repeal or cause to be forgotten, We will replace them with something superior or comparable. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things? Do you not know that Allah reigns sovereign over the heavens and earth and besides Him you have no protector or helper? Would you question your messenger as Moses was questioned in his time? Those who exchange their faith for disbelief have gone astray from the right path." (emphasis added)

Let's just say for a second that you buy the idea behind the verse, that God didn't say something exactly the way he wanted it said (the Quran is supposed to be recited to Mohammed directly from an angel of the Lord, you recall -- perfect recitation and memorization is therefore a key aspect of Islam). Well, the last time I checked "superior or comparable" did not mean "change the entire meaning", which is certainly what the authors of this article demonstrate has been done.

Big-time bookmark.

15 posted on 10/17/2010 9:48:34 PM PDT by alancarp (Please don't tell Obama what comes after "trillion")
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To: conservativegramma

Islam is not a peaceful religion. It is, however, a seductive one.

16 posted on 10/17/2010 9:49:10 PM PDT by Psalm 144
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To: Vigilanteman
**As anyone who reads the New Testament knows, the major concerns of Jesus were the care of his aged mother, the welfare of his apostles and the preaching of his Gospel. IOW, everything Christ did in his final hours showed humility and concern for others.**

And forgiving his enemies.

Last Seven Words of Christ:


17 posted on 10/17/2010 9:58:21 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Lloyd227


18 posted on 10/17/2010 10:05:36 PM PDT by VRWCer ( They will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. - ML King)
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To: Psalm 144; goat granny

Agree in full.

19 posted on 10/17/2010 10:06:45 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: Lloyd227

20 posted on 10/17/2010 10:07:34 PM PDT by skinkinthegrass (Imam Zer0: DeathCARE, Is my plan...So just die (quicky), please & save $$$$ :^)
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