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To: Mad Dawg
Jesus also said of the Pharisees that one should do as they say but not as they do. I don't think it follows from what H said of them that he was against all of their "traditions of men." He was very much against the traditions that worked against piety and justice, like "Corban."


ref=e-Sword: Compare

(KJV) All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

(KJV+) AllG3956 thereforeG3767 whatsoeverG3745 G302 they bidG2036 youG5213 observe,G5083 that observeG5083 andG2532 do;G4160 butG1161 doG4160 notG3361 ye afterG2596 theirG846 works:G2041 forG1063 they say,G3004 andG2532 doG4160 not.G3756

ref=e-Sword: Strong's Concordance

G2036
ἔπω
epō
ep'-o
A primary verb (used only in the definite past tense, the others being borrowed from G2046, G4483 and G5346); to speak or say (by word or writting): - answer, bid, bring word, call, command, grant, say (on), speak, tell. Compare G3004.

The word "they" is implied, and the word "bid" is past tense:


"All therefore whatsoever they [Moses' seat (Moses) had] bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their (the Pharisees') works: for they say, and do not (they do not follow Moses)."

Jesus cannot be telling people to follow others against the Torah. That is just silly.

6,664 posted on 08/04/2010 4:26:10 PM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just Socialism in a business suit)
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To: smvoice; Iscool
OOPS! (((ping)))
6,665 posted on 08/04/2010 4:34:59 PM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just Socialism in a business suit)
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To: roamer_1; Mad Dawg
Nowhere did the Hebrew Scriptures instruct the Jews to set up the Sanhedrin, to submit to the teachings of the scribes and Pharisees, or to recognize the authority of oral Tradition alongside Scriptures.

The scribes and Pharisees had not received their authority from God. Which is why Jesus said, "The scribes and Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses" (Matt. 23:2.

Which is why a showdown was inevitable. (Matt. 15:1-9) and (Mark 7:1-13). Jesus Christ refused to subject His ministry to the Sanhedrin, the scribes and the Pharisees, or Tradition.

"Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written, "this people honors Me with their lips, But their heart is far away from Me. But in vain do they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the precepts of men." (Mark 7:6,7).

He just wasn't into pious hypocrisy and the merging of the 'unwritten Torah' or oral Tradition with the 'written Torah' or Scripture.

It didn't work then, and it doesn't work now.

6,672 posted on 08/04/2010 4:51:08 PM PDT by smvoice (smvoice- formally known as small voice in the wilderness. Easier on the typing!)
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To: roamer_1
A primary verb (used only in the definite past tense, the others being borrowed from G2046, G4483 and G5346); to speak or say (by word or writting): - answer, bid, bring word, call, command, grant, say (on), speak, tell. Compare G3004.
The word "they" is implied, and the word "bid" is past tense:

Well επωσιν sure looks like a third person plural verb, so the "they" is not really "implied." It's explicit in the verb ending. And "seat" is singular. The grammar seems to say the ones sitting on Moses' seat, the scribes and the pharisees are the ones who did the "have said."

6,754 posted on 08/04/2010 7:42:22 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee. here)
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