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To: livius

Thank you for your enlightening and courteous reply.

To an outside observer, it appears the Catholic church is an organized yet disorganized institution. The church maintains strict Canon law and contains a formal leadership structure however Bishops retain extreme autonomy with little concern for redress from the Pope.

For example, I’ve been calling for the removal of Cardinals Law and Mahony yet it appears it simply isn’t possible.

It would appear that this organized/disorganized system opens the church to tremendous liability.

Perhaps the answer is to give the Pope more power or completely disorganize?


27 posted on 07/02/2010 5:57:22 AM PDT by TSgt (We will always be prepared, so we may always be free. - Ronald Reagan)
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To: TSgt

You wrote:

“For example, I’ve been calling for the removal of Cardinals Law and Mahony yet it appears it simply isn’t possible.”

(sigh) Law WAS REMOVED. He is no longer the head of a diocese. As far as I know he heads nothing else of importance either. Mahoney will be out in a few months. And quite frankly no one should listen to what you wnat anyway.


29 posted on 07/02/2010 6:00:11 AM PDT by vladimir998 (Part of the Vast Catholic Conspiracy (hat tip to Kells))
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To: TSgt
To an outside observer, it appears the Catholic church is an organized yet disorganized institution.

Mmmmm, yes and no. It's more like a gigantic family that has some pretty severe disfunctional tendedcies.

I’ve been calling for the removal of Cardinals Law and Mahony yet it appears it simply isn’t possible.

I've lost track of Law, unless he's still the rector at St. Mary Major. Mahoney is being pushed out early. For a sitting cardinal to get a coadjutor before 80, let alone have his resignation at 75 accepted (see Egan in New York, although he was 77), indicates displeasure from Rome. Mahoney turns 75 in February and he is gone. His replacement is already there and he has a massive mess to clean up.

32 posted on 07/02/2010 6:07:01 AM PDT by Desdemona (One Havanese is never enough.)
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To: TSgt
I think you're KIND of right.

As I said in some other thread, we moderns don't have a 'template' for understanding the polity of the Catholic Church.

One image I play with is that it's like an autocracy with a very lazy autocrat, whose first response to anything related to the polity as such will be, "Deal! I'm busy!"

Not that the Pope (or any Pope recently) is lazy. It's that they think their job is more teaching and preaching and time spent on this or that system or process takes away from their primary call and responsibility.

So not only is is a principle that resonsibility should devolve downwards to the lowest possible level, but - on the rare occasions when it works, it gives the Pope more time to teach and preach.

And this even has to do with the "development" of doctrine. That is, most questions on which the Pope pronounces do not originate in the Vatican. It's more than these guys over HERE are saying, "We think the Son is of like substance with the Father," while those guys over THERE are saying, We think the Son is of ONE substance with the Father." So if the fight gets nasty enough, either a council has to be called or the Pope has got to rear back and come out with some resolution.

it appears the Catholic church is an organized yet disorganized institution.
I think that's pretty good. I have said that when I was outside the Church I thought of it as this amazingly well-oiled, slick, efficient bureaucracy cum intelligence service. But I have come to think of it as more like an avalanche -- a huge chaotic mess, rolling down hill, swallowing trees and small buildings as it rolls ......

And as I have said way too many times: I don't believe in organized religion; I'm a Catholic. Among Catholics that almost always gets a laugh.

68 posted on 07/02/2010 8:29:32 AM PDT by Mad Dawg ("Be kind to everyone you meet, for every person is fighting a great battle" -- St. Ephraim)
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