| This thread has been locked, it will not receive new replies. |
|
Locked on 04/28/2010 11:54:24 PM PDT by Admin Moderator, reason:
Per poster’s request |
Posted on 04/18/2010 9:49:35 PM PDT by Judith Anne
I seriously wonder about some FReepers, sometimes. Any other person accused of a crime would be defended by every FReeper as being innocent until proven guilty by a court of law. I've seen whole threads written by men who have been accused of child abuse by ex-wives out to deny them their visitation rights or to wrest more money out of them. These men are rightly indignant, and furious about the unjust accusations that cannot be proven but are never withdrawn.
Yet where are those FReepers when a PRIEST is accused? Where is the presumption of innocence? Suddenly, every accusation becomes a verdict, and not only the accused but his entire organization and all its adherents are held responsible.
I can only wonder what some of these so-called conservatives (who so faithfully defend the Constitution) would do, if THEY were the ones accused! It is a nightmare for any man -- all of you know how even the accusation stains the man forever, even if it is proven false!
Not only that, many here assert that the problems of 30, 40 and even 50 years ago must be tried in the media TODAY!
Remember the Duke rape case? There are more similarities than differences here. The priests are accused, nifonged, and instead of being defended, they are vilified!
What other man of you could stand under the weight of such an accusation trumpeted by the press, and come out whole? None! And such accusations made, LONG after the statute of limitations has passed, sometimes even after the accused is dead and buried for YEARS -- are YOU one of those who automatically, reflexively, spitefully, and gleefully act as judge, jury, and executioner?
Women! What if it were YOUR HUSBAND, YOUR BROTHER, YOUR FATHER, YOUR UNCLE, YOUR SON who was accused? Wouldn't you want the best defense possible? Wouldn't YOU believe in their innocence? Wouldn't YOU help protect your loved ones as much as possible? And yet, YOU JUDGE THE CHURCH FOR DOING WHAT YOU WOULD DO?
Shame! Vast shame! On all who have sinned against the innocent!
Question and Answer
Elder Visitation: What to Expect
Question:
A previous Q & A dealt with the matter of "elder visitation." Do you have anything that can be given to members of a congregation to better prepare them for what to expect when elders come to visit?
Answer:
I wrote this for local use, but you may use it in your own congregation if you find it helpful.
Introduction
Why are they coming to our house? What do they want to talk about? Did we do something wrong? Questions such as these are not uncommon when the average modern evangelical finds their name listed on an Elder Visitation Schedule at church. While the practice of elder visitation is not as common as it once was, your elders love you and are committed to shepherding your soul as those who will give an account on the last day.
The purpose of this article is to help prepare you for your upcoming elder visit so that it will be most profitable for both you and your elders.
Hospitality
While it might seem more convenient to conduct this visit at the church building, your elders believe that there is still value in house to house fellowship. Further, please remember that God promises special (and sometimes surprise) blessings to those who are willing to be hospitable. All your elders are asking of you is a quiet place to meet and enough seats for everyone. If you wish to provide refreshments, you certainly may; but please keep them light. You elders are coming to serve you and they do not want you missing the better part.
Attendance
It is the hope of your elders that they will be able to visit with the entire family (children included). Since these visits are typically scheduled in the evening, your elders will endeavor to be sensitive to your children’s bedtimes. Consider having the children present for the first 20 minutes and then dismissing them to bed. This will also provide opportunity for a more intimate and non-distracted visit for the parents.
Atmosphere
Since this will be a spiritual and prayerful visit, your elders ask that all worldly distractions be temporarily removed. You will probably want to turn off the television or radio and prepare to have the answering machine catch incoming phone calls. If there are young children in the house, they should be told something to this effect: We are having church at home tonight and everyone needs to be calm and quiet.
Conversation
While it is natural to engage in small talk when someone visits your home, please remember that your elders are hoping for something more than a conversation about the weather, sports, etc. After initial pleasantries have been exchanged and everyone is comfortable, your elders will be expecting to inquire as to the spiritual health and well-being of your family. Please accommodate.
Questions
While an elder visit is not intended to feel like an inquisition, your elders find that the best way to initiate spiritual conversation is to ask questions. You elders may inquire into the following areas:
Church Attendance
Personal Devotions
Family Worship
Education of Children
Catechetical Instruction
Household Government
Relationships in Church
Utilization of Gifts
Reputation in Neighborhood
Again, the intent of such inquiries is not to interrogate, but so that the elders can better understand, edify, and instruct your family.
Participation
Despite the one-sided appearance of such an inquiry, please remember that your elders are ultimately there to serve you. Please participate fully and freely in this conversation and ask questions of your elders as well. If there is something about the church’s doctrine or practice that you don’t understand, this would be an opportune time to discuss it.
Complaints
It is not uncommon for families to regard an elder visit as an opportunity to voice all their concerns and complaints about the church. While your elders do want to hear legitimate concerns, their hope for a home visit is that it would be positive and edifying. Gossip or slander against other members will not be tolerated and a charge against an elder cannot be received without two or three credible witnesses. If you do have legitimate concerns and complaints against a member or officer, it might be best to bring this matter to an upcoming session meeting.
Prayer
One of the chief duties and privileges of your elders is to pray with and for the families under their spiritual charge. During the visit, please be sure to share your family’s recent joys, sorrows, and continued struggles so that your elders can bring those matters to the throne of grace. The visit will end with a time of prayer and the elders will indicate whether is will be led by one person or be open to group participation.
Conclusion
It is the hope of your elders that this article has prepared you for a visit that will be profitable to your soul and to their pastoral work. Amen.
Here’s the link:
http://www.opc.org/qa.html?question_id=340
So, an elder cannot be accused of child sexual abuse without multiple witnesses? The elsers can inquire into your marriage, your finances, your reputation in your neighborhood, your church reputation, your church attendance, etc., and this is not supposed to be considered an inquisition?
Ridiculous! There is apparently no “seal of the confessional” with these inquisitors, either. They can bring up anything you tell them to the church session, at their discretion.
I cannot imagine why ANYONE would subject him/herself to this.
Disgusting!
Hey Cousin!
Good grief. You still have your tongue?
Anything less than idolizing Mary is tantamount to poking a sharp stick in a Catholic’s eye.
I don't know what the Athenasian Creed is...But where did Athenasius get his information on the Trinity if not from scripture???
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you still believe in evolution, don't you???
ph
INDEED.
One sometimes wonders how some folks function trusting more in their fantasies than they do in ‘normal’ ‘reality.’
Sure seems to be that way with the folks in the rabid cliques, anyway.
I was hoping you and Dr. E could explain that to us.
But if he will not hear [thee, then] take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell [it] unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. - Matthew 18:15-17
Nope.
Mind reading is against the rules.
. . . EVEN THOUGH a LOT of rabid clique types seem to work hard trying to make it easy.
INDEED.
And few congregations seem to think enough of those priceless Scriptures to apply them responsibly, diligently, fittingly.
Sigh.
So God lived inside the ark of the covenant, eh??? Well, if your going to make up stories about Mary, I guess you can make up stories about God as well to match your Mary story...
That's not a problem because I was asking for you and the good doctor to explain your mindless preoccupation with all things Catholic and denial of the problems in your own pews and mirrors.
OBVIOUSLY MORE
BEARING FALSE WITNESS from the DOUBLE STANDARD, DOUBLE-SPEAK departments of the Vatican Institution.
I’ve frequently criticized Pentecostals hereon for various things many times over the years.
Perhaps you weren’t paying attention, again.
Which white hanky dogma is the one about special indulgences for being dishonest being OK against Prottys?
Has tooo much of the stinky dofu
caused any . . . uhhh . . . problems with normal thought processes?
Some individuals would be inclined to strike back by means varying from gossip to murder. Some individuals would be inclined to pack up and leave rather than confront the offender and prevent it from happening again.
And the traditions of some assemblies stand in contrast to Jesus' words on how to handle offenses. An individual in such an assembly may take his own assembly's traditions more seriously than the words of God.
But if he will not hear [thee, then] take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell [it] unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. - Matthew 18:15-17
Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: - Luke 6:37
Blessed [are] the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. – Matt 5:7
And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. - Matt 6:12
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. - Matt 6:13-14
Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive [them], and ye shall have [them]. And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses. – Mark 11:24-26
To God be the glory, not man, never man.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.