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Posted on 04/18/2010 9:49:35 PM PDT by Judith Anne
I seriously wonder about some FReepers, sometimes. Any other person accused of a crime would be defended by every FReeper as being innocent until proven guilty by a court of law. I've seen whole threads written by men who have been accused of child abuse by ex-wives out to deny them their visitation rights or to wrest more money out of them. These men are rightly indignant, and furious about the unjust accusations that cannot be proven but are never withdrawn.
Yet where are those FReepers when a PRIEST is accused? Where is the presumption of innocence? Suddenly, every accusation becomes a verdict, and not only the accused but his entire organization and all its adherents are held responsible.
I can only wonder what some of these so-called conservatives (who so faithfully defend the Constitution) would do, if THEY were the ones accused! It is a nightmare for any man -- all of you know how even the accusation stains the man forever, even if it is proven false!
Not only that, many here assert that the problems of 30, 40 and even 50 years ago must be tried in the media TODAY!
Remember the Duke rape case? There are more similarities than differences here. The priests are accused, nifonged, and instead of being defended, they are vilified!
What other man of you could stand under the weight of such an accusation trumpeted by the press, and come out whole? None! And such accusations made, LONG after the statute of limitations has passed, sometimes even after the accused is dead and buried for YEARS -- are YOU one of those who automatically, reflexively, spitefully, and gleefully act as judge, jury, and executioner?
Women! What if it were YOUR HUSBAND, YOUR BROTHER, YOUR FATHER, YOUR UNCLE, YOUR SON who was accused? Wouldn't you want the best defense possible? Wouldn't YOU believe in their innocence? Wouldn't YOU help protect your loved ones as much as possible? And yet, YOU JUDGE THE CHURCH FOR DOING WHAT YOU WOULD DO?
Shame! Vast shame! On all who have sinned against the innocent!
Sadly, it is not.
Exactly! And heretical gibberish you peddle at that!
All evidence is to the contrary and since pedophiles and pederasts work in secrecy your continued absolute denial makes you an accessory.
This statement is “false”, “wrong”, “inaccurate” and “misleading”.
Yes it is.
MARK BSNR: How often? How many times? Speak up, we are waiting with bated breath.
I wouldn't want your breath batted too long, Mark. So here's one instance...
For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. I am crucified with Christ: neverthless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain." -- Galatians 2:11-21"But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
Study, Mark, to show thyself approved.
” This, to me, completely misses the entire meaning of the word GRACE...”
Then you are in a tiny minority. Most of Christendom recognized and still does the truth taught for 20 centuries by the Catholic Church.
"Open" threads on the Religion Forum are a town square. Posters may argue for or against beliefs, religious authorities, dieties, etc. It can become contentious.
If you are uncomfortable with that style of debate, ignore the "open" RF threads altogether and instead read and post to threads labeled "prayer" "devotional" "caucus" or "ecumenical."
Unlike in Roman Catholic churches which are at the center of this scandal.
Not my church. Yours.
For nine months! After that, just like all those who place their trust in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, she and we become the Temple of the Holy Spirit. We are all indwelt with the Spirit of Christ. I do not dishonor Mary at all by accepting what the Bible says about all having sinned and needing the grace of God through Jesus to be saved. Mary herself rejoiced and trusted in "God my Savior.". She is a sister in the family of God and not its mother.
And, she and Joseph raised the child Jesus together, he would have been perfect regardless because he was God INCARNATE.
“She is a sister in the family of God and not its mother.”
Again you place yourself OUTSIDE Orthodox Christianity. Why?
Amen. As the Bible teaches those with ears to hear.
Thank you. Why are Mary’s prayers less than yours?
...except by the veil of denial.
When every credible source states that all forms of fornication, buggery, and perversion exists within your community and its clergy and yet you deny it in total you are either knowingly or ignorantly complicit. Although there is no evidence to support it I pray it is the latter. Repent and beg the forgiveness of the victims of OPC molestation.
Then I am happy to be in that "tiny minority". I live my life in obedience to God because I love him, I am forever grateful for his unspeakable gift and because he has given me a "new nature" that even has this desire to live for him. I am not "perfect" in the human sense but when God looks at me he sees the righteouness which is of God because I am found IN HIM not having my own righteouness, but that which is through faith in Christ.
Philippians 3:8-10
Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
Rejecting centuries of Christian theology makes you happy?
Acts 5:29
Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
Fabrication. Falsehood.
Question and Answer
Confidentiality guidelines for elder visits
Question:
Are matters that members share with elders on home visits confidential? Do elders report to the Session what has been shared with them? Do you have guidelines on confidentiality when elders do home visits?
Answer:
This is a very good question. The Session on which I serve follows this general rule: If it is information that is necessary to provide oversight of a member's soul, it is going to be shared with the rest of the Session unless there is good reason not to.
With regard to your elders, it might depend upon whether or not you asked them not to repeat what is told to them. For the most part the elders have come to see how you are doing spiritually and are not interested in gossip.
But there are times when matters discussed are of importance to the church and perhaps to your soul. For example, if you say you intend to become a Muslim, or you intend to murder a neighbor, or you are angry with the pastor, such information needs to be given to the rest of the session (or in the last example, the pastor needs to know, don't you think?). On the other hand, that you struggle with your faith, or you wish you had spent more time in the last year reading your Bible, or are not sure how to share your faith, those things are not likely to be made a major item of discussion. Do you see the difference?
Your best option, though, is to ask the elders up front what your Session's policy is. And if you are going to tell them something you want kept private, just ask them to keep it confidential. On the whole the best guidelines are found in Ephesians 4:29.
If someone confides that they are going to murder their neighbor, why wouldn't the elders go straight to the police?
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