When the Sun Turned Black

Insight Scoop ^ | December 5, 2009 | Paul Glynn, S.M.

[B-Chan]

War itself is immoral because it violated God’s commandment “Thou Shalt Not Kill”. Once Society has stepped across that line, there is no such thing as a sliding scale of immorality: sin is sin and you don’t get bonus points with God by being only slightly less sinful than the other guy.

So if a country goes to war, it has already crossed over that moral hurdle: the next-best thing to be done is to win quickly and decisively to minimize the suffering and transgression.

This is essentially my position as well. In the modern age, all war is evil. With this in mind, when war is unavoidable, we should do what is necessary to end it as quickly as possible.

However, I also insist that we face the moral reality of what we do in war. Instead of making a cowardly attempt to justify the deaths of civilians we caused during the bombings of Japan, we need to look at the innocent lives we took during the war with Japan and say "Yes, we murdered them. May God forgive us."

[magisterium]

I am astonished to find any argument on FR which is in apparent agreement with Chris Matthews that West Point and the American military is the ‘Enemy Camp’.

When did I say that? I'll thank you not to put words in my mouth in a hyperbolic effort to squelch discussion. That's what Roland Freisler and his ilk did at Nazi show-trials. It's not necessary here.

As for my comments equating to what you say above, take it up with Eisenhower. He and I seem to share the same opinion regarding the topic of this thread. I trust that does not automatically brand him in the same way you brand me.

I'm done with this thread. There has yet to be anyone to step forward and explain clearly, within a Christian context, exactly how it's "okay" to deliberately target women and children as legitimate targets of war. At least with a blockade, the direct object is to deprive the military of the resources (such as oil) necessary to continue fighting. Only ancillary to that comes food into the equation. Japan was not entirely self-sufficient in food production, but it would have taken a long time to deplete the rice stock to the point where complete food collapse was imminent. A thorough blockade would deplete other raw materials for war much sooner than the food would entirely run out, if mass starvation was even a concern. Japan had no navy left, no air force left, and about half of its army bottled-up in Manchuria. They were all done for fighting anywhere. It was not necessary to nuke them twice over. And it was just as much murder to do so as it was murder for the Germans to terror-bomb London during the Blitz. Only we won the war, so there were no consequences. In this life, anyway.

Adios, warmongers. If we're ever in the unfortunate position where nukes are dropping on our cities, and some of you guys are standing right under them, I hope the pragmatic, utilitarian parts of your brains kick in with this thought, as you're about to be atomized: "Well, whatever. I guess those guys are just trying to shorten their war with us. Can't quarrel with that. Can't see any moral problem with myself, my spouse, my children and my neighbors going out with a...."

[B-Chan]

‘Nuff said. Let’s all drop it.

[Uri’el-2012]

U-2012>Is there one God ? or are there two or three ?

One God in Three Persons, the Holy Trinity.

Where in the Holy Word of G-d did YHvH
say "One God in Three Persons, the Holy Trinity" ?

Or is this something a man made up to define
and demean the creator of the universe ?

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[Petronski]

Where in the Holy Word of God did God say sola Scriptura?

Or is this something a man made up to define and demean the creator of the universe?

[Uri’el-2012]

War itself is immoral because it violated
God’s commandment “Thou Shalt Not Kill”.

I don't find that anywhere in YHvH's commandments: :

NAU Exodus 20:13 "You shall not murder.

NAU Deuteronomy 5:17 'You shall not murder.

Other references are
Exod. 20:13; Deut. 5:17; Ps. 62:3; 94:6; Jer. 7:9; Hos. 4:2; 6:9; Matt. 5:21; 19:18; Mk. 10:19; 15:7; Lk. 18:20; 23:19, 25; Acts 9:1; Rom. 1:29; 13:9; Jas. 2:11; 4:2

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[Uri’el-2012]

sola Scriptura?

is a pejoritive term made up by the Roman church to describe
anyone who trust only in YHvH's scripture and not man-made
Tradition.

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[Petronski]

is a pejoritive term made up by the Roman church to describe anyone who trust only in YHvH's scripture and not man-made Tradition.

Thank God you're not describing the Catholic Church!

[cthemfly25]

Conor-—My father too was spared. After having fought in Europe he had not been home to even see the birth of my older brother. He was being deployed for the Japan mainland invasion when VJ day was announced and he returned home to his family.

[Uri’el-2012]

Believe any myth you wish.

All will be judged by YHvH and his salvation on His Word.

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[Waco]

Think Pearl Harbor, think WTC, now wake-up!!!

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

When did I say that? I'll thank you not to put words in my mouth in a hyperbolic effort to squelch discussion.

If it were true that, in comparison to the Germans and Japanese, 'by the end of the war, we were doing just as many - and more! - war crimes as they ever did.' then the American Army would be in an enemy camp from me. Anyone who implies that the American forces were morally inferior to the Nazi SS troops can ever be trusted in their judgment on security matters.

[Petronski]

Believe any myth you wish.

Despite your invitation to mythology, I believe in no myths.

[Uri’el-2012]

When you stand before YHvH,
the quiz will not be on the Roman catechism.

The quiz will only YHvH's Word.

Do you accept YHvH's salvation ?

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[TASMANIANRED]

War is hell and innocents die.

Japan did not surrender after Hiroshima.

My father would have been fighting alongside yours.

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Your father could have been ‘saved’ by choosing demonstration targets that destroyed military installations, instead we burned alive and poisoned civilians.

Didn't sneakers point out that Hiroshima and Nagasaki were industrial centers for the Japanese military?

[Petronski]

When you stand before YHvH, the quiz will not be on the Roman catechism.

Great, because I know nothing of any Roman catechism. I don't speak Italian either.

Thank God the Catechism of the Catholic Church is available in English.

[TASMANIANRED]

Bataan Death march.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

The fact of the matter is that no one in Japan just plain wanted to fight to the bitter end,

You really don't understand what was going on.

When the Emperor decided to make peace there was an attempted palace coup.

The general population of Japan had to be ORDERED not to commit suicide by the Emperor when told that they were surrendering.

Trying to judge what they would have done by western standards is foolishness.

As for the idea blockade, Japan is not a barren island chain, it has many resources to use to keep fighting, there was never a blockade that could not be broached, it would have required the entire Allied fleet plus and the Japanese would have used every weapon they had to break it and that includes the biological and chemical ones they had used in the past.

You still would have killed far more people then using the A-bombs did.

[narses]

Bombing specific industrial sites using the force necessary to destroy them and no more, legit - incinerating an entire city to terrorize a people, immoral.