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To: marshmallow

>>Only those approved by you?<<

Where did I ever say that?

>>As for JPII, the liberals take just the opposite view and call him an ogre who did his best to squelch the “reforms” in the Church. They hated him for Ecclesia Dei and his dogmatic pronouncement on women “priests”. Some conservatives, on the other hand, think he wasn’t Catholic enough. <<

So?
Everyone has friends and enemies. I don’t care at all about the opinions of people. I care about the good of The Church, which JPII neglected while he blended services with Holy Masses, allowed crap on altars at Papal Masses and “ministered” to non-Catholics while our pews were emptying from disgust.

I’m about as Catholic as you get, but I’m not blinded by the hype. He still ignored the problems with the gays in the priesthood while they took over. Destroying parishes and lives. Not for a year, not for five years, FOR nearly 20 years. We need to be realistic about it.

Where was he? He was praying. Well his job was to Shepherd as well as pray. Shepherd HIS flock. He neglected us. That is not the making of a saint.


11 posted on 11/17/2009 2:21:38 PM PST by netmilsmom (Psalm 109:8 - Let his days be few; and let another take his office)
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To: netmilsmom

In my opinion JPII wasn’t really that “great”. He may have written many new encyclicals and things of that nature. But a saint?! I don’t think so. JPII was hated by liberals true enough. More should have been done.


12 posted on 11/17/2009 2:55:43 PM PST by Pope Pius XII (There's no such thing as divorce)
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To: netmilsmom; marshmallow
I care about the good of The Church, which JPII neglected while he blended services with Holy Masses, allowed crap on altars at Papal Masses and “ministered” to non-Catholics while our pews were emptying from disgust.

Again ... your statements lack support. Can you provide some specifics?

He still ignored the problems with the gays in the priesthood while they took over.

The gay priests took over the Church? My dear, the problem of homosexuality is as old as the cockroach. There have been gays in the priesthood for centuries. Are we to fault all of the popes for not "acting" to remove them?

Destroying parishes and lives. Not for a year, not for five years, FOR nearly 20 years. We need to be realistic about it.

Which parishes did the JPII destroy?

16 posted on 11/17/2009 3:13:17 PM PST by NYer ( "One Who Prays Is Not Afraid; One Who Prays Is Never Alone"- Benedict XVI)
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To: netmilsmom
Me:Only those approved by you?

You:Where did I ever say that?

Here's what you said:

"So yes, when JPII is made a saint, I will (as will many others) doubt the process. We do now".

I interpret this to mean that if JPII is canonized you will not accept it. Am I wrong?

If the current (or a future) Pope signs a Papal Decree to the effect that JPII is now St. JPII and you don't accept it, that means that the last word on JPII's sanctity rests not with the Sacred Congregation and Pope but with you. Right?

So I repeat my question. If JPII's process is flawed, then who else has been mistakenly canonized? If the process is flawed then a major and very important function of the Church has been compromised. This is not a trivial question. If the Church can not reliably tell us who is and who is not a saint, then what can it tell us? If the Church is placing before us, as worthy of our imitation, men and women who in fact do not rise to that standard, then the whole of the Church's credibility is called into question.

You are making an extremely serious allegation.

21 posted on 11/17/2009 7:15:03 PM PST by marshmallow ("A country which kills its own children has no future" -Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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