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To: DouglasKC; Godzilla; aruanan; UriÂ’el-2012

Let’s see...trust the Greek knowledge of the translators of the ESV & NASB, or you? Tough choice...

OK, lets see how it is translated elsewhere:

Luk 4:9 And he led Him to Jerusalem and had Him stand on the pinnacle of the temple, and said to Him, “If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down from here;

Luk 13:31 Just at that time some Pharisees approached, saying to Him, “Go away, leave here, for Herod wants to kill You.”

Jhn 7:3 Therefore His brothers said to Him, “Leave here and go into Judea, so that Your disciples also may see Your works which You are doing.

Jhn 14:31 but so that the world may know that I love the Father, I do exactly as the Father commanded Me. Get up, let us go from here.

Jhn 18:36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm.”

Jhn 19:18 There they crucified Him, and with Him two other men, one on either side, and Jesus in between.

Jam 4:1 What is the source of quarrels and conflicts among you? Is not the source your pleasures that wage war in your members?

Rev 22:2 in the middle of its street. On either side of the river was the tree of life, bearing twelve {kinds of} fruit, yielding its fruit every month; and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

here, here, here, here, this realm, either side, source, either side.

The translators of the ESV & NASB were not fools. They gave a good translation.

You say you don’t follow Armstrong, but are a member of the United Church of God...from Wiki:

UCG is an offshoot of the Worldwide Church of God, which was originally incorporated in the 1940’s as the Radio Church of God by its founder, Herbert W. Armstrong. After Armstrong’s death, the subsequent WCG leadership introduced a series of major doctrinal changes which substantially altered the fundamental beliefs and goals of the original Worldwide Church of God. A segment of the membership wished to retain Herbert Armstrong’s theology and teachings (which is known by non-adherents as “Armstrongism”) and left WCG to start their own organizations. The United Church of God was established in May of 1995 and is the largest of these offshoot organizations.”

Further:

“Doctrinal distinctives include:

* Belief in a non-Trinitarian view of God. Specifically, the belief that the Holy Spirit is the spirit/power of God and of Christ Jesus rather than a separate person in the Godhead. God ‘the Father’ and Jesus Christ are viewed as distinct ‘God beings’ in a ‘God family’.[1] [2][3] [4]
* Belief that Christians are part of the family of God and will at their resurrection be “spirit-born divine beings who are part of Elohim, the universe-ruling family of God.” [5]
* Belief that the core of Jesus Christ’s message was the coming of a literal earthly Kingdom [6][7] and that people who are saved will not go to heaven but will live and rule eternally with Jesus Christ after his second coming. [8]
* Belief that the final destination of the wicked is not everlasting torture but annihilation or permanent destruction. [9]
* Belief in British Israelism, which is the theory that those of Western European descent, primarily the United States and the United Kingdom, are direct physical descendants of the Ten Lost Tribes of ancient Israel.[10]
* Belief that Old Covenant laws (excluding ancient civil laws and temple laws) are applicable to Christians today.[11] Examples include seventh-day Sabbath,[12] dietary laws,[13] and Holy Days.[14]”

Just so folks know where you are coming from...when a cult member starts translating, it is best to know he isn’t playing from a full deck.


63 posted on 11/01/2009 12:38:36 AM PDT by Mr Rogers (I loathe the ground he slithers on!)
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To: Mr Rogers
Just so folks know where you are coming from...when a cult member starts translating, it is best to know he isn’t playing from a full deck.

I ran into the same problem with the Russellites. They butcher Greek. They invent things. They leave out things. They flatly mistranslate things. I've got to wonder who they hired to do their various translations. Did they give them a guideline of what certain verses had to say and which to ignore completely or did the hired guns do a reasonably good job and the JW hierarchy later go through the result doing their doctrinally required emendations?
64 posted on 11/01/2009 5:42:40 AM PST by aruanan
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To: Mr Rogers
Just so folks know where you are coming from...when a cult member starts translating, it is best to know he isn’t playing from a full deck.

Indeed! Especially when they are selective in their 'translation' and refuse to incorporate parallel passages that clarify the translation.

70 posted on 11/01/2009 6:54:42 AM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: Mr Rogers
Just so folks know where you are coming from...when a cult member starts translating, it is best to know he isn’t playing from a full deck.

Are you a Christian sir?

81 posted on 11/01/2009 12:32:12 PM PST by DouglasKC
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