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To: MarkBsnr; Quix
Giggle all you wish. I will state it once again that you have never given a cogent definitive proof of the aliens that you keep hinting at.

Proof is awfully nice, but most human knowledge exists without proof and much (actually, all) human endeavor proceeds without absolute assurances because absolute assurances don't exist.

In fact, proof itself is a relative thing that is usually accepted by some folks who believe it and disputed by others who debunk it.

It all comes down to how one reaches a conclusion for what he knows or thinks he knows. Actual proof—absolute, undeniable proof—is a rare commodity (if it exists at all) and if the world demanded absolute proof before taking action...well, you see my point.

What we "think" we know is based on a mixture of circumstantial evidence, intuition, and hearsay sorted out using our deductive and inductive reasoning.

Now, as to whether or not Quix is correct, who knows...not even Quix knows for sure.

But based on his experience, his analysis of the data at hand (certainly including the experiences reported by others), he has reach some interesting conclusions.

As to the previously posted survey...

SURVEY:

1. What percentage of Quix’s standard summaries re UFO’s and FALLEN ANGELS/ET’s do you tend to believe—as in believe it highly likely to be true or mostly true? ______%

2. What percentage of Quix’s standard summaries of such stuff do you tend to believe as in plausible to highly probable? _______%

3. What percentage of Quix’s standard summaries of such stuff do you tend to believe is mostly to almost totally government disinformation; lies from hell; rantings of crazy people etc.? _______%

...my own opinion is based not on shining silvery disks, but on reports made by people who believe they have been abducted by aliens.

First, let me add that the experiences of abductees as reported still may not be real, but might be something that has occurred inside their brains (like a hallucination or vision). However, these people believe they have been abducted and that such aliens exist and their reports are quite consistent considering upwards of a million people have made and are continuing to make such claims.

Also let me point out that there is some supporting evidence in the corroborative claims of people who were abducted while traveling together and some cases wherein there were witnesses who saw the abductions but were not themselves abducted. Furthermore, there are the cases of pregnancy among women abductees (with records of such being kept by their physicians) who later found they were no longer pregnant but had no recollection of a miscarriage.

Long story short, there is substantial circumstantial evidence and hearsay that there is the existence of something at least masquerading as alien.

And that brings us to the question of whether these creatures (if they exist) are what they claim to be...or are they lying about their identity.

As to the identity of the so-called aliens, it helps to analyzed their activities and character. Based on the reports of the abductees, they have been very consistently described as terrorist and rapists. They take people from the safety of their homes or from their cars while traveling without permission and subject them roughly to horrible treatment which for some strange reason seems to involve sex. They, in fact, sufficiently terrorize their subjects to such a degree that ALL those abducted exhibit signs of profound PTSD.

Final note:

Is it possible that such creatures are what some Christians believe to be "fallen angels"? As a Christian, I think it is quite possible that this is true. Non Christians might have a different view, of course.

For those who do not believe in the existence of angels, fallen or otherwise, I will add that Dr Allan Hynek (who was initially a strong skeptic/debunker regarding the existence of UFO's only to later, after being confronted with overwhelming "evidence," have a change of "opinion") came to think that such "aliens" were not extraterrestrial, but were, in fact, extra-dimensional.

Bottom line:

I tend to "think" Quix is correct about the alien/fallen angel "theory".

As to question #3 (lies from hell, government disinformation, crazy people)? I have nothing on which to base any conclusion of government disinformation...so I would have to offer no opinion pro or con.

As to "lies from hell", I would add only that IMO (as a Christian) Satan is the Father of Lies and would certainly not be above such a thing.

As to "crazy people", I would restate for purposes of clarity what I think is being suggested and that is this...is it possible that all this alien talk is hysterical and/or the product of chemical reactions within the brain? It is commonly known that dimethyltryptamine (DMT) and other psychotropic drugs have caused experiences similar in nature to alien abductions and DMT is found in trace amounts inside the human body. So, yes, it is "possible" that such experiences take place entirely within the brain, mind and/or even soul of the experiencer.

727 posted on 10/24/2009 11:19:17 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies (For good judgment ask...What would Obama do? Then do the opposite!)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

VERY EXCELLENT POINTS VERY WELL MADE

HOWEVER,

the ‘in the brain only’ explanation for abductions

would NOT account for the

1. scoop marks
2. implants
3. retrieved foetuses at the end of the first trimester—often enough after a gynecological exam that day with another followed the next day verifying no more baby.
4. designs on the skin of various standard shapes unique to such experiences.

. . .

. . .

BTW, there are calculated from the well done extensive Harris Poll . . . that there are AT LEAST MORE THAN 3 million abductees, IIRC.


730 posted on 10/24/2009 11:30:11 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

***Proof is awfully nice, but most human knowledge exists without proof and much (actually, all) human endeavor proceeds without absolute assurances because absolute assurances don’t exist.***

Most human ‘knowledge’ exists with some sort of backup evidence. This alien intereference idea has existed for a couple of hundred years and has had zero substantiation. With the claims of such commonplace incidents, there ought to be a large collection of proofs or at least overwhelming evidence.

***Now, as to whether or not Quix is correct, who knows...not even Quix knows for sure.***

Therefore the claims are simply claims and do not amount to anything more.

***First, let me add that the experiences of abductees as reported still may not be real, but might be something that has occurred inside their brains (like a hallucination or vision). However, these people believe they have been abducted and that such aliens exist and their reports are quite consistent considering upwards of a million people have made and are continuing to make such claims.***

A million?

***As to the identity of the so-called aliens, it helps to analyzed their activities and character. Based on the reports of the abductees, they have been very consistently described as terrorist and rapists. They take people from the safety of their homes or from their cars while traveling without permission and subject them roughly to horrible treatment which for some strange reason seems to involve sex. They, in fact, sufficiently terrorize their subjects to such a degree that ALL those abducted exhibit signs of profound PTSD.***

However, if the abductions are real, it is still not proven, shown, or even indicated that the abductors are aliens.

***I tend to “think” Quix is correct about the alien/fallen angel “theory”.***

He may well be. But there is nothing to indicate it and therefore one must not fall into the trap of referring to such a theory as fact.

***As to “crazy people”, I would restate for purposes of clarity what I think is being suggested and that is this...is it possible that all this alien talk is hysterical and/or the product of chemical reactions within the brain? It is commonly known that dimethyltryptamine (DMT) and other psychotropic drugs have caused experiences similar in nature to alien abductions and DMT is found in trace amounts inside the human body. So, yes, it is “possible” that such experiences take place entirely within the brain, mind and/or even soul of the experiencer.***

Barring physical and/or electronic evidence, one must come to this conclusion.


752 posted on 10/24/2009 2:26:54 PM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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