[bad] Bishops Curry, Kicanas Dismiss Sanctions, Stress Virtue of “Dialogue” ... ND Scandal

LifeSiteNews.com -- Your Life, Family and Culture Outpost ^ | Friday June 19, 2009 | By Kathleen Gilbert

[topher]

Friday June 19, 2009

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Bishops Curry, Kicanas Dismiss Sanctions, Stress Virtue of “Dialogue” in Wake of ND Scandal

By Kathleen Gilbert

SAN ANTONIO, Texas, June 19, 2009 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Two bishops questioned on the U.S. prelates' response to the Notre Dame scandal have suggested that the correct attitude to pro-abortion politicans at Catholic universities is unclear, and agreed with University president Fr. John Jenkins' emphasis on the paramount need for “dialogue.”

Auxiliary Bishop Thomas Curry of Los Angeles told John Allen of the National Catholic Reporter during the USCCB's spring meeting that he suspected the bishops would bring up the unprecedented controversy that stemmed from the University of Notre Dame's invitation of President Obama to offer the commencement speech and receive an honorary degree May 17. Over 360,000 petitioning individuals and 80 active U.S. bishops opposed the event, which was boycotted by Notre Dame's own Bishop John D'Arcy.

Curry emphasized a need for dialogue in the abortion debate, likening the current situation between the Catholic Church and pro-abortion politics to the Church's struggle with the advent of religious pluralism.

"The church struggled with that for a hundred years or more, but we did come to live with it," said Curry.

"We have to come to be able to do two things: to challenge people who differ drastically from us, but also to dialogue with them," he continued. "There are great issues involved, and we have to make clear distinctions between endorsing something, challenging it, and engaging it."

Curry also said that whether the Obama invitation violated 2004 U.S. bishops' policy is part of what is "under discussion" among the bishops at the conference. The 2004 USCCB document "Catholics in Political Life," cited by most of the bishops condemning the scandal, stated: "The Catholic community and Catholic institutions should not honor those who act in defiance of our fundamental moral principles. They should not be given awards, honors or platforms which would suggest support for their actions."

Bishop Curry said he was confident that Notre Dame and the U.S. bishops "are on the same side," and that he did not think punitive measures against universities non-compliant with USCCB policy would be "useful."

In a separate interview, Allen asked Tucson Bishop Gerald Kicanas how clear he felt the bishops' position is on the matter of pro-abortion politicians at schools.

"For example, let’s say a Catholic university president called you today and said, ‘We want to give an honorary degree to Vice President Biden.’ Would it be clear to you how you should respond to that?" Allen questioned.

"I think a lot would depend on the circumstances of it," Kicanas responded. "It’s a theoretical question, so it’s hard for me to answer."

Kicanas also gave ground to Fr. Jenkins' defense that the 2004 document may be interpreted to refer only to Catholic politicians. "It may be that there was some lack of clarity about the statement itself. It did refer to ‘Catholic politicians’ in the title," he said. 

Kicanas did not directly answer whether punitive measures should be considered as a next step, saying only that the disagreement should be approached "carefully, sensitively, more in a spirit of conversation."

The bishop objected to Allen's implication that Notre Dame "deliberately defied" the bishops' guidelines by inviting Obama.

"I think that’s a pretty harsh statement," said Kicanas. "They may have interpreted the document differently. The first thing is to be sure of what we are indeed saying, what we’re agreeing to, and then bringing that to the institutions within one’s own diocese. It is a dialogic thing."

Bishop Kicanas ranks among the U.S. bishops more accessible to liberal Catholics for his pronounced advocacy of "progressive" social justice issues, unto relative dismissal of the abortion issue. In 2006, Kicanas lauded Congressman Jim Kolbe, who earned a 100% rating by NARAL, as "a good and faithful advocate of assistance to lift up the poorest of the poor.” 

One other bishop who stressed the need for “dialogue,” in line with Notre Dame's own argument, was Archbishop Emeritus John Quinn of San Francisco. Just before the commencement, Quinn criticized the "often strident outcries" of the bishops who opposed Obama's invitation, and issued a letter of support to the President.

Links:

Auxiliary Bishop Curry interview

Bishop Kicanas interview

See related LifeSiteNews.com coverage:

San Francisco Abp. Emeritus Issues Letter of Support to Obama amid ND Scandal http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/may/09051508.html

Lay Catholics Go After Bishop For Support Of Pro-Abortion Politicians 
http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2006/jun/06061406.html

URL: http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/jun/09061913.html

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[topher]

The really bad one is from Los Angeles. I guess the Cardinal of that Diocese sets the bad example to follow...

[ConorMacNessa]

They are in league with the Evil One! What kind of dialogue can you have with remorseless murderers for convenience?

Lamh Foistenach Abu!

[topher]

The USCCB needs to start making examples of these bad colleges/universities.

If they want to retain their Catholic identity, then they should act like "Catholic" colleges/universities...

De-list Notre Dame, Georgetown, Boston College for 5 fives from the Catholic directory. Then review whether or not to "re-instate" the colleges/universities.

That is my idea of "dialogue"...

[elpadre]

and, for how long do you dialogue?? It seems we have been dialoging with the abortion and homosexual activists for 30 years. When does it end?? And what happens then??

[La Lydia]

...the correct attitude to pro-abortion politicans at Catholic universities is unclear...Pathetic. Total lack of moral clarity. This is shameful.

[topher]

The term used in the Gospels for Jesus is Rabboni or teacher.

Jesus told the woman caught in the act of adultery to "go and sin no more", He did not engage in conversation. He did not kill her, as He wanted to show mercy -- especially since it is possible that she might gave have or would have become pregnant from the act of adultery (my speculation).

The dialogue is "you broke the rules, so now you are going to be punished... The more you resist, the harsher the punishment..."

[ardara]

The leadership in the pro-life movement is up to the LAITY as it always has been.

[Robert A Cook PE]

Dialog:

“I want to murder innocent babies for the political convenience of the mother’s party.”

“Let’s talk about that.”

“I want to murder innocent babies for the political convenience of the mother’s party.”

“But what do you really want?”

“I want to murder innocent babies for the political convenience of the mother’s party.”

“But what do you need?”

“I want to murder innocent babies for the political convenience of the mother’s party.”

...

Repeat.

[MarkBsnr]

***Dialog:***

I think that the dialogue needs to be between those in the tent and those outside of the tent. And Bishop D’Arcy, a fine and strong Bishop, is absolutely correct and these two morons need to be dealt with suchly: Matthew 13:
41
The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will collect out of his kingdom 21 all who cause others to sin and all evildoers.
42
They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.

Matthew 25:
26
His master said to him in reply, ‘You wicked, lazy servant! 11 So you knew that I harvest where I did not plant and gather where I did not scatter?
27
Should you not then have put my money in the bank so that I could have got it back with interest on my return?
28
Now then! Take the talent from him and give it to the one with ten.
29
12 For to everyone who has, more will be given and he will grow rich; but from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away.
30
13 And throw this useless servant into the darkness outside, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.’

We need some more wailing and grinding of teeth going on temporally.

[MHGinTN]

When one has ‘dialog’ with evil, it lends credence to evil’s whispers. Eventually, the truth grows dim and very hard to hear over the growing roar of Legion closing in.

[dangus]

Wow, Bishop Kicanis (Is that pronounced “Kiss anus?”) is definitely associated with the lavendar Mafia.

* He came up through the ranks of the Chicago priesthood during the era of Cardinal Bernadin. Bernadin was the godfather of the lavendar mafia, who passionately promoted the notion that promoting abortion was no worse than failing to support welfare programs. Bernadin’s outing as a pedophile triggered the collapse of the building media attention to pedophilia in the early 1990s, and eventually his accuser recanted under heavy medication. After his death, more accusers came forward, some depicting satanic ritualized sexual abuse involving consecrated hosts. His roommate and neighboring metropolitan, Archbishop Weakland resigned due to pedophilia charges and has since his retirement come out openly as a homosexual activist.

* How to chalk this one up as being about anything other than the lavendar mafia? He called Rep. Jim Kolbe a “tireless advocate for the poor.” Here’s the kicker: Kicanas normally supported liberal Democrats, and the Democrats’ “advocacy for the poor” is the standard reason why Bernadin, etc., always leaned Democratic. But Kolbe was a Republican. Why support this one Republican? Kolbe was a rank-and-file Republican on many issues, but he was an outed homosexual who was accused of inappropriate sexual behavior by several children who went on camping trips with him. Another issue that caused him to be labeled a RINO was his record of support for killing babies, which earned him a perfect 100% rating from NARAL/Pro-Choice America. (In another, more non-partisan issue than is important to many conservatives, Kolbe also favored “guest workers.” This isn’t just amnesty; this is the importation of laborers for the purpose of exploiting cheap labor, a practice which the most echoed papal encyclical in history calls, “a grave sin, which cries out to the skies for vengeance.”

* Kicanas was no mere bystander to the sexual abuse horrors of Chicago. He was rector of the Maundelain seminary. His doctorate is in Education Psychology, not divinity, or cannon law, theology, etc..

[Robert A Cook PE]

“By his ‘friends’ ye shall know him” .....

How many other pedophilia priests were promoted/sheltered by these few initial homosexuals?

[dangus]

I believe the expression is “By his fruits ye shall know him.” :^D

[Salvation]

 

Archdiocese of Los Angeles

Most Reverend Thomas J. Curry
Santa Barbara Pastoral Region
3240 Calle Pinon
Santa Barbara, CA 93105

[dangus]

Archbishop Quinn, the other bishop cited as defending Obama, was forced into early retirement. The exact reasons aren’t known, but there were three scandals at the time: The resignation of two very high-ranking priests involved in pedophilia, the closing of several churches over the protests of 41 priests, and the celebration of a blasphemous homosexual ritual in the cathedral. My guess is the third is the one which triggered his resignation.

(According to Tradition in Action; I couldn’t locate their cited sources on the web.)

[Salvation]

 

Most Reverend Gerald F. Kicanas
Diocese of Tucson
P.O. Box 31
Tucson, AZ 85702

[shibumi]

But, but, but..... maybe we can get them to murder the babies a little less ..... so they’re not quite dead .....

(..... or maybe we can get them to not murder the babies on Sunday, since that’s the day we’re all going to Holy Communion .....)

[Salvation]

**Archbishop Quinn, the other bishop cited as defending Obama, was forced into early retirement. **

Perhaps that will happen to these two bishops also.

[shibumi]

You see, his friends were all fruits .....

[wintertime]

on the paramount need for “dialogue.”
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Talk is cheap.

I used to be a Catholic. One of the reasons I left was due to the corruption throughout the Church: The corruption of those orders that preached Marxist Liberation Theology, the colleges and universities filled to the brim with those who worshiped “social justice” more than God, the decaying seminaries,..etc.

It hasn't improved in over 50 decades that I have been aware that something is seriously wrong here.

I think of it like gangrene. Gangrene needs to be amputated! If it isn't it will poison the entire body ( as in the Body of the Church and all those in it). Personally, I don't want to be made sick, or my family either.

This is why I am no longer Catholic.

Are there a **lot** of things right about Catholic doctrine? Yes, you bet! Personally, I wish we had a nation full to the brim with Catholics and their priests and bishops who fully practiced what is found in their catechism. Our nation and its families would be so much stronger if were.