Posted on 05/27/2009 1:01:05 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
John Calvin was a Frenchman, but he is being remembered in Geneva this week because it was here that he built Calvinism. Invited to reform the city in 1541, almost as what would now be called a management consultant, he formed an alliance with the city fathers. Over the next 20 years of preaching and pastoring they turned this tiny city, with a population then of only 10,000, into a model of church government and theology which has changed the world.
His followers now form the third-largest Christian grouping in the world. The world alliance of reformed churches claims 75 million members, and while this is a lower headline figure than the Anglican Communion's 80 million, it is not inflated by 25 million nominal Anglicans in Britain.
Although Calvinism is shrinking in western Europe and North America, it is experiencing an extraordinary success in China. I spent some time on Monday talking to the Rev May Tan, from Singapore, where the overseas Chinese community has close links with mainland China. The story she told of the spread of Calvinist religion as an elite religion in China was quite extraordinary. There may be some parallels with the growth of Calvinism in South Korea, where the biggest presbyterian churches in the world are to be found, but it's absolutely unlike the pattern in Africa and Latin America. There, the fastest growing forms of Christianity are pentecostal, and they are spreading among the poor.
But in China neither of those things are to be true.
Calvinists despise pentecostalists. They shudder at unbridled emotion. If they are slain in the spirit, it is with a single, decorous thump: there's to be no rolling afterwards. And in China, the place where Calvinism is spreading fastest is the elite universities, fuelled
(Excerpt) Read more at guardian.co.uk ...
Dutch - sorry, I should’ve pinged you to my #20 as well.
Wonderful post.
One of the things that drew me to Reformed Theology, besides the obvious Scriptural backing, was the fact that you didn't have to believe it to be saved. In every other systematic theology I've encoutered (primarily Arminianim and Catholicism), if you don't believe it, you can't be saved. In Reformed theology, you can believe it or not - it doesn't matter. If God's chosen you, you're of the elect, regardless of what you call yourself. That removes the whole idea of "only one of us can be right and everyone else is going to Hell."
There is such a thing as "style" of worship, although I hate to use that term. Maybe "mode" would be better.
The Bible says that King David worshipped the Lord by dancing so vigorously that he partially disrobed himself. Now, I'm not advocating installation of brass poles between the pews, by any means, but it's there in Scripture and must be accounted for. The Bible also talks about approaching God reverentially, in holy silence. That also must be accounted for.
I think that we must always separate our personal preferences from what the Scripture actually says. Some are more reserved by nature, and some are more outgoing. However we choose to worship, we should do it to the glory of God.
There's a song that sums it up perfectly:
Surrounded by Your glory, what will my heart feel
Will I dance for you Jesus or in awe of you be still
Will I stand in your presence or to my knees will I fall
Will I sing hallelujah, will I be able to speak at all
I can only imagine
There is a lot packed in this response of yours. Let me take this one piece at a time.
First, “That’s all of his ministry in your view?” Not sure how you intend this. I used the term “ministry” in the colloquial sense, meaning that when Jesus taught groups of people, His principal objective was to raise the bar of the Law so high, explain the holiness required of God so well, that the Jews listening fell on their faces in frustration crying, “This is impossible. I am not like this! What can be done?”
Obviously, as the message permeated the minds of the Jews, they took up a different response, one more like, “Just who do you think you are, coming here and condemning us for being less than what God wants? Aren’t you awfully arrogant to think you have that right?” In the end, this resistance fomented into utter hatred, much like the Pharisees, who couldn’t stand to listen to His accusations any longer. The crowds grew to despise Jesus backhanded ways of pouring out the real appraisal of their self-righteousness.
But, all of this effort was pointed principally to the Jews. Matt. 15 records the Syrophoenician woman (a Gentile) coming to Jesus for help. Notice, prior to the cross. She begs for His assistance and He refuses, telling her that He was sent, “...only to the lost sheep of Israel.” This is one of several clues that the Messiah’s message was first for Israel.
Then, comes the day, fully managed and directed by God, that His own fully reject this assessment of them and the recognition of their predicament. They do not want to be helpless, hopeless, and lost, thank you. So, they turn and kill Him. Well, they use the Romans to drive the nails, but it is their hatred, their hunger to silence the criticism that brought Him there.
And, then here is another part of His “ministry”. He becomes both the only Just One and the Justifier (Rom. 3). The precious blood shed by the Lamb provided by God washes those whom He was calling clean. It also operated to wash every chosen person that had lived up to that moment clean, and it provided the propitiation for every person to be born, that was chosen, to eventually be cleaned.
So, if I sounded like I was limiting His “ministry” to that part of the message, my apologies. What I was countering was that His message was not an attempt to teach “Christian Living” to his listeners. This is a common misunderstanding and it mimics the same misunderstanding the Jews held when they listened to Him.
When the young ruler asked, “What can I do to be saved?” please notice the answer is before the cross. And it is an answer that you would not give anyone now. You would never say, “Oh, just keep the Law.” But, Jesus gave that answer. Then the young man says, “Oh, I have already done that.” I’m sure Jesus was thinking, “Right. You have no idea what keeping the Law means, friend.” But, He goes on to say, “Well, then just sell everything and give the money to the poor and follow Me.” Wait just a minute! Now, I just cannot do that. Okay, we are getting somewhere.
When the young man left, even the disciples said, “There is no hope for anyone!” You are right! The Hope is Me. With man it is impossible, with God, nothing is impossible. Listen to His message. You cannot do this, you did not do this, you don’t do this, you will never be able to do this. But, I can do this. If you hear His voice...you are one of His sheep. If you want to perform it yourself...you are still lost.
So, Jesus “ministry” was much more involved than I may have implied originally. But, it was not to teach you, a Gentile, how to live. During the forty days He met with the disciples (then becoming the Apostles), He taught them this. How do we know? Because this is the message Paul taught following his personal tutorial with Jesus. Read the letter to the Romans all the way through. The Law is gone, grace has come to overpower the stubborn elect, break their hearts, and drag them into the Kingdom in spite of themselves, not because of them. What an amazing message!
Yes, absolutely. My original concern was that when the Arminian perspective is taught, it becomes something very close to a false gospel, insofar as it returns the person to themselves. “God has done all that He can do, now it is up to you. You must choose, or you risk being lost forever. He has thrown the life preserver, just reach out, but it must be you, since He will not force you.”
But, then we read about Paul on the Damascus road. The butcher from Jerusalem, knocked to the ground, blinded, jammed into recognizing his own rebellion. We just don’t see the “busses will wait while we sing one more verse of “Just as I am”, come down here now, while you have the chance. What if you died tonight?”
Instead , we have this wonderful message of rescue by the Rescuer, Him seeking us, Him giving us life while we were still dead in our trespasses and sin...truly Grace.
So, you are right, my FRiend. It certainly does remove the need to be correct to be saved. It removes the need to believe it in order to be elect. I may have stated it too strongly. What I was hoping to point out was that when it comes to teaching the Gospel, we should be stating the truth, not some human-powered, self-help story akin to a religious Tony Robbins course. I’ll tread a little more lightly next time.
Grace be with you.
And, may I add the very telling passage in Acts 2:23, 24 “...this Man (Jesus), delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.”
The church in Rome purposely elicited temporal feelings with appeals to the senses through its ornate churches and velvet robes and intoxicating incense and decorated statues depicting the bloody suffering of man.
The Reformers, however, knew our senses can be easily beguiled. They realized Rome's stubborn emphasis on tactile, worldly emotions obscured the clarity of the written word of God which God gave us to penetrate directly into our minds in order to regenerate our consciences to behold Christ alone.
Further, after reading the Bible for themselves, the Reformers believed this obscuring of God's word was intentional because it was so easily refuted in Scripture.
This is one reason Paul spent so much time encouraging disciples not to simply feel, but to truly know their salvation had been won for them by the risen Christ.
"And be renewed in the spirit of your mind" -- Ephesians 4:23
"And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him" -- Colossians 3:10"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." -- Romans 12:2
I just attempted to say as much in the above post. As always, Calvin is succinct, on point and Godly.
I grew up in an Arminian denomination -- I can't tell you how many times I've heard that last line!
I guess what bothers me is that in reading the various religion threads here on FR, I see very little Christian brotherly love. I see lots Christians denouncing other Christians as heretics or worse. I see people behaving in foul-tempered, nasty ways that would earn my 3 year old a spanking. And for what? Disagreements over non-essentials of the Faith. Paul said that he "delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures..." Anything outside of that must be of secondary importance.
I frankly see very little of Christ in most of the Christian threads on FR. If nothing else, I want to see a little civility between Christian brothers.
Okay. I'm done ranting. :)
bttt
Yep I agree. Watching true joy in the Lord would make me happy if its dancing and all that. Although I would never do it. I cannot help but feel that many do it as a show, but who am I to judge unjustly?
But Doc, I gotta ask - aren't we commanded to worship in both spirit AND truth? In practice, it's too often reduced to either or.
I've come to believe an understanding of the doctrine of grace is another gift from God to those He loves. He may love others, but they are farther from Him without the confident knowing that His will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
I have only to look at my own life before and after being given this awareness. I was a Trinitarian Christian then, believing Jesus Christ to be my Lord, Savior and King. But now I am a happier Christian because the focus has been taken off me and my filthy rags and put on Christ's work on the cross alone. It's such a relief to know that "all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose" (whether they know it or not.)
And it's better to know it. God willing, that number grows daily.
I believe both the “spirit” and the “truth” are knowable and as rational as our minds are capable of grasping. I sing as loud as anyone in church, but I try to concentrate on the words. The music may move me, but it’s the words that make me cry.
Ping to a really encouraging article. There’s hope for this old world yet. 8~)
Amen!
You're right. I grew up in a very Charismatic church, and I saw it firsthand a million times.
However (funny how there's always a however), if we're honest, we can make the same argument that the folks who sit quietly in our Presbyterian pews aren't 'silent in awe of God,' they're bored out of their minds or using it as the opportunity to relax and eye the cute girl in the slightly too tight dress.
I agree with that totally.
I'd go with your choice, pray with him and for him, and then hand him a copy of the Institutes.
Where there's life, there's hope. 8~)
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