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To: annalex

“Absolutely. The saved are just like Mary, and you can pray to them just like you pray to Mary. The difference is not that Mary is in heaven and others are not — all the saints are in heaven with Christ; the difference is that she is described as filled with grace even before the Incarnation.

As you know, St. Stephen the first Martyr is also described as full of grace, but the original Greek is different. Of course, with Stephen, the infusion of grace is described just prior to his martyrdom and did not precede the Passion of Christ.

Saved by Faith. Through Grace. Nothing else.

Mary is described as sinless in Luke 1:28. St. Joseph is not described as sinless at all and the Church does not ask you to believe he was. You can pray to him, he is the patron of fathers, workers, of all weighted with doubt, of happy death and many others. His feast day is March 19.”

Mary is NOT described as sinless in Luke 1:28. Let me step you through it:

‘28And he came to her and said, “Greetings, O favored one, the Lord is with you”’

Where does it say Mary is without sin? She was favored by The Father to be overshadowed by the Spirit in order for Christ to be born incarnate. The angel says NOTHING about her being sinless. God says nothing of Mary’s sinlessness. Once again, no doubt, the hoodoo of holy tradition has taught you that... but, if so, you were taught in error. ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. ALL. INCLUSIVE. Mary too! And Joseph. And I will not be an idolator and pray to them, or to anyone other than the one true living God.

If you’re praying to a “saint”, you’re an idolator. It’s simple. Prayer is a form of worship. If you’re worshipping anyone other than God, you’re wrong... in a BAD way.

Hoss


243 posted on 01/27/2009 4:12:04 PM PST by HossB86
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To: HossB86

You have an obfuscatory Protestant translation of Luke 1:28. The original epithet the angel applies to Mary is “kecharitomeneh”. That is a unique formation from “charis”, grace. It literally means something like “engraced”, but significant here is that as the angel speaks she is already filled with grace, — the grammatical form implies her “engracedness” in the past.

I bet you nowhere else does your translation use “favor” for grace. Go see how it translates St. Pauls discources on grace, for example, in Ephesians. Does it say “by favor we saved through faith”? Now ask yourself why the Protestant translators would choose to obscure the original meaning in Luke 1:28?

You have been lied to.

Prayer to saints is worship of God. I explained why: because the saints are God’s best creation and are with God.


244 posted on 01/27/2009 4:25:51 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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