Replies

You wrote:

“Eh, so you’re getting judged twice...”

You are judged immediately at death. All are judged - and all sins exposed - at the Last Judgment.

“Really??? How does that work then??? You kick the Holy Spirit out of your body??? Or does He just get bored and leave your body??? At what point does the Holy Spirit leave your body??? When you sin??? After you haven’t made a confession for 45 days??? “

You tell me. After all, you’re denying that people can renounce God by what you’re saying. Can Christians become atheists? Yes. Can they renounce Christ and become a Muslim? Yes. Sadly so.

“You are one confused puppy...No one gets Saved by cooperating...”

So you’re back to saying people get saved by resisting God then? Can you please choose SOMETHING? Can you? You keep vacillating between those two: 1) you admit people can’t be saved resisting God. Yet, 2) you keep insisting no cooperation is necessary on the part of the man.

How can that be? If a man is not resisting, isn’t he cooperating?

“Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

So now people have to do a work? Isn’t calling upon the Lord a work? And what about Matthew 7:21? “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.”

Apparently not everyone calling upon the Lord will be saved - at least if you believe Jesus. So which is it?

Oh, and notice that last part of the verse: “...but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.”

He WHO DOES the will of my Father. Sure sounds like cooperation to me. Will you now deny Christ’s words, Iscool?

“You don’t cooperate with grace to gain salvation...You call on the name of THAT one who died for all...”

According to Matthew 7:21, Iscool, you are supposed to cooperate with God. I believe scripture over you. Also, common sense tells you that if you’re not cooperating with God, you’re resisting Him. Again, can you be saved resisting God?

“At one time in this conversation you equate cooperation to work...”

No, actually I used your understanding of work and cooperation. I did it to show that your explanations make no sense. And they don’t.

“Now,you claim it’s openness...Make up your mind...Openness and works are not the same thing...And NEITHER one of those will bring you into the presence of Jesus...”

1) I know Protestants who would call openness a work. The problem is that every Protestant has his own made up theology that has everything to do with his feelings and little to do with reality and scripture.

2) You have to make up your mind. If you have a wife, ask her if cooperating with her would include being open to her doing something for you. You already know what she’ll say don’t you? She’ll say yes, of course.

“Wasn’t any interpretation involved...Just readin’ what it says...If you don’t want to believe what it says, have at it...”

If you just read what’s there, then stop denying “Working together”.

Here’s what you avoided:

“LOL...I’ve answered you time and again...”

Nope. Here again is all that you have refused to respond to for at least the second or third time:

My question still stands: “I never once mentioned salvation in regard to Matthew 3:7-9. Yet you claim I did. Why misconstrue what I so clearly wrote? I wrote: “...about repentence: In Matthew 3:7–9, John says to the Pharisees...” and again “It is a call to turn away from sin. Sincere repentance requires turning away from sin.”
Where in that paragraph do you see me mention either the word or concept of salvation? Where? I hope you have the courage to answer that question. I really, really do.”

Since I said repentance and nothing about salvation there, why did you misconstrue what I said? Was it purposeful?

Here’s what else you have refused to respond to:

That’s called charity. What does James say about faith and charity in James 2?

And you have avoided really dealing with this:

That’s a common and completely ineffectual response from many OSAS believers. The simple reality is that there are people - intelligent, educated, once God-fearing people - who, for whatever reason, lose their faith, and even renounce Jesus. It’s happened. There are Christians - including Protestants ministers - who have become Muslims. Is that not a denial of Christ? Are you really going to claim these people were never Christians? Sorry, but they - and everyone who knows them - would insist otherwise.

Dismissing it as an impossibility when it is known to happen is not dealing with it.

And not surprisingly, you refused to deal with this:

You don’t believe? Reality has little to do with what you believe then. Men defy God. They reject God. And sadly, they can worship false gods. By the way, do you believe Catholics are Christians then who DO NOT worship false gods? If you believe we are Christians, and you don’t believe those who have been filled with the Holy Spirit can turn to “another” god, then you don’t believe it is possible for Catholics to be idolators. So, even if we pray to Mary - according to your logic (IF you believe we are Christians) - we are not doing anything wrong, right?

So, what will it be? Will you now say that Catholics were never Christians to begin with?

That would be amusing for you to say at this point. Do you know why?

Think about those Protestants who become Catholics. I guess you’ll have to either say that (if Catholics are not Christians) then those Protestant converts have turned “to ‘another’ God after being filled with the Holy Spirit...”

If you’re going to say that Catholics are Christians, then praying to Mary can’t be wrong because it can’t be idolatry since we would - according to your logic - never turn to another god, false god, etc.

Why dodge my questions? Why are you afraid about who is reading this? I already asked you about a Christian denying Christ and becoming a Hindu and you dodged those questions too? Why are you so afraid?

now you write:

“And NO, I don’t have to reconcile your very faulty notion of what constitutes Salvation...We do NOT work with Jesus for our Salvation...”

We resist Him instead and are saved anyway? Go ahead and claim that resisting Christ lives to salvation if that’s the kooky idea you believe. If that is not what you believe, then at least state how you believe we do or do not resist Him and are saved. Can you do that much?

“It’s a FREE GIFT...We SEEK Jesus and ASK him for the FREE GIFT...We work with Him AFTER He has given us the FREE GIFT...And it is He who does the works in us...”

Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! We seek Him to be saved? Is that a work, Iscool? Can you be saved without seeking out Jesus then? Can you?

“And like the Prodgal son; if we turn from God, He is anxious for us to return...We are NOT disowned; kicked out...Our home is STILL our home...We will not lose our inheritance...We may not get the best robes, or the many gifts, but we still have a home...”

So, losing all faith in Christ still means we go to Heaven? Is that what you’re claiming now Iscool? Are you now going to say that someone who denies Christ as His Savior and Lord must never have been a Christian believer in the first place? Is that what you’ll do now, Iscool?

That’s okay. By now, if anyone is reading these posts, they’re probably as used to your avoiding my questions as I am! But seriously, how can you essentially claim a man can be saved by denying Christ? And if you’re going to now claim you don’t believe that, then please explain how a man can renounce Christ and still go to Heaven without repentance? And if you’re going to claim you don’t believe that either, then try to make some sense some how related to that issue.

Thanks!