Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Hegel as Sorcerer: The "Science" of Second Realities and the "Death" of God
Self | November 10, 2008 | Jean F. Drew

Posted on 11/10/2008 11:37:17 AM PST by betty boop

Hegel as Sorcerer:
The “Science” of Second Realities and the “Death” of God

 

by Jean F. Drew

 

 

 

A friend asked for an explanation of a remark I recently made on a public forum that the great German philosospher, Hegel, was a “sorcerer.” I’m glad for this opportunity to respond. For the spirit of Hegel is alive and well today in the construction of any Second Reality, of which I regard the recent Obama Campaign to have been a splendid example.

 

Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel (1770–1831) was a world-class philosopher — a master of classical philosophy, and a master system-builder. He is usually associated with the period of German Idealism in the decades following Immanuel Kant. The most systematic of the post-Kantian idealists, Hegel attempted to elaborate a comprehensive systematic ontology, or “science of being,” from a “logical” or “rational” starting point. He is perhaps most well-known for his teleological, “goal-directed,” even eschatological, account of human history — a model which was later appropriated by his notable follower Karl Marx, who developed Hegel’s “dialectical science” into his own theory of historical development (“dialectical materialism”), which by “historical necessity” culminates in communism.

 

Sorcery, or magic, is a conceptual system that asserts the human ability to control the natural world (including events, objects, people, and physical phenomena) through mystical, paranormal, or supernatural means — through, for example, magic words, or an ability to present compelling appearances of fictitious reality.

 

A Second Reality is such an ersatz reality. The term was coined by Robert Musil to denote a fictitious world imagined to be true by the person creating it, who will then use his construction to mask and thereby “eclipse” genuine, or First Reality.

 

In 1807, Hegel published his grimoirei.e., a magician’s book of spells and incantations — the Phänomenologie, which takes as its main goal the transformation of philosophy, the “love of knowledge,” into the final, complete possession of “real knowledge,” by means of his system of “absolute science.” Of his accomplishment the great German-American philosopher Eric Voegelin (1901–1985) would write, “No modern propaganda minister could have devised a more harmless-sounding, persuasively progressivist phrase as a screen for the enormity transacted behind it.”

 

For Hegel, “‘Absolute knowledge’ was to be the form ‘in which the pure consciousness of the infinite is possible without the determinateness of an individual, independent life.’” In short, the Phänomenologie “admits no reality but consciousness…. [Yet] since consciousness must be somebody’s consciousness of something, and neither God nor man is admitted as somebody or something, the consciousness must be consciousness of itself. Its absolute reality is, therefore, properly identified as ‘the identity of identity and nonidentity.’ The substance becomes the subject, and the subject the substance, in the process of a consciousness that is immanent to itself…. The reader would justly ask what a consciousness that is nobody’s consciousness could possibly be?”[1]

 

And with that question, noetically astute observers realize we must be dealing with a Second Reality: It appears that “Hegel the sorcerer” wants to eclipse our image of reality by a counterimage conjured up to furnish a plausible basis for the action he calls for.

 

As Vöegelin notes, “in order to be effective as a magic opus,” Hegel’s system of absolute science had to satisfy two conditions:

 

(1)  The operation in Second Reality has to look as if it were an operation in First Reality.

(2)  The operation in Second Reality has to escape critical control and judgment by the criteria of First Reality. (I have noticed that President-Elect Obama excels in conducting both types of operations.)[2]

 

So, what is First Reality? In effect, it is the classical Greek (and Judeo-Christian) description of the context in which human existence is actually experienced and lived. That is to say, the human condition is specified by man’s participation in a Great Hierarchy of Being that extends beyond, encompasses, and shapes his existence as a man.

 

Being is a philosophical term referring to the fundamental structure or order of the world. Vöegelin, following the classical Greeks, defines being as “not an object, but a context of order in which are placed all experienced complexes of reality….” Thus the Great Hierarchy of Being consists of four partners: God, Man, World, and Society. The individual man, as “part” of this “whole,” finds his own humanity in his participatory experiences and relations with the other partners of the hierarchy, and most especially in his relation to God.

 

Strangely, given his “revolt” against God and man and the world, Hegel was a man who not only insisted on his Christian orthodoxy up to his dying day; but as already mentioned, he was a master of classical Greek philosophy. So clearly he was aware of First Reality in the above sense. His “magical opus” is motivated fundamentally by a desire to overturn and supplant it with a plausible Second Reality of his own imaginative construction.

 

The first “partner” of the Great Hierarchy that had to go was God. This was necessary in order to make room for Hegel as the “new Christ” who would usher in the “third religion” of his System of Absolute Science, so to be the Messiah, the New Christ, of the new age a-borning. The point here is that with God “gone,” man himself becomes a pure abstraction and, as such, an ideologically manipulatable entity and nothing more.

 

As far as I know, it was Voegelin who first drew attention to the element of sorcery in Hegel’s work — even though the language Hegel had been using from the first was the language of the “magic word” and the “magic force” (Zauberworte and Zauberkraft respectively). Vöegelin indeed identified the Phänomenologie as a sorcerer’s grimoire. My sense is if Vöegelin was joking here, he was only half-joking: Something very serious is going on. So we need first of all to understand what Hegel intended by evoking such language. As for instance, here:

 

“Every single man is but a blind link in the chain of absolute necessity by which the world builds itself forth. The single man can elevate himself to dominance over an appreciable length of this chain only if he knows the direction in which the great necessity [i.e., the Geist of history] wants to move and if he learns from this knowledge to pronounce the magic words (die Zauberworte) that will evoke its shape (Gestalt).”[3]

 

We need to define our terms here: Geist can be translated from the German as either “mind” or “spirit”; but the latter, allowing for a more cultural sense, as in the phrase “spirit of the age” (“Zeitgeist”), seems a more suitable rendering for Hegel’s use of the term. Gestalt (plural: Gestalten) means the present historical configuration of events as the Geist inexorably moves or evolves in time towards the fulfillment of its final  “absolute necessity,” at which point — in its final Gestalt, which in Hegel’s system is identified with the consciousness of Hegel expressing as the complete identity of absolute Self and absolute Idea — world history ends; and a “new age” of Man, “standing alone,” begins. Because man is now “alone,” Hegel teaches that now he has arrived at the point in history where he can grant “grace to himself,” to “save himself,” to perfect the human condition, without the salvific Grace of God.

 

And Hegel’s enormously influential student Karl Marx (1818–1883) took the lesson to heart:

 

“Philosophy makes no secret of it. The confession of Prometheus, ‘In a word, I hate all the gods,’ is its own confession, its own verdict against all gods heavenly and earthly who do not acknowledge human self-consciousness as the supreme deity. There shall be none beside it.”[4]

 

“A being regards itself as independent only when it stands in its own feet; and it stands on its feet only when it owes its existence to itself alone. A man who lives by the grace of another [including God] considers himself a dependent being. But I live by the grace of another completely if I owe him not only the maintenance of my life but also its creation: if he is the source of my life; and my life necessarily has such a cause outside itself if it is not my own creation.”[5]

 

And so the “outside cause” — God — must “die” in order for man to be “liberated” for self-sanctification and self-salvation.

 

In light of such expectations, first of all, we need to remember that a “magic word” in itself does not evoke an actual creative act. Rather, it is the invocation of appearances, of illusions. “Magic words” do not have the power actually to change the structure of being, of reality; but only the way the sorcerer wants us to see it. If he is successful, then we are grievously misled.

 

Hegel’s famous epigone Friedrich Nietzsche (1844–1900) had a field day with Hegel’s insights. He not only declared God “dead,” but claimed that “we” had “murdered” Him. Mankind, on this view, has finally gained the existential status not only to be in a position to “kill God,” but also to grant itself “grace” and “salvation” via human reason alone. Of course, these are the maunderings of a person who sadly died in an insane asylum. Nonetheless, Nietzsche is splendidly honored by the “progressives” among us to this day….

 

It’s interesting to note that many students of the Phänomenologie consistently over time have reported that to be drawn into the “magic circle” of this enterprise is to enter into a perfectly logically self-consistent construction — so long as one does not use the criteria of First Reality to judge it. But finally, all criticism by appeal to reality itself, i.e., as actually experienced by human beings in contrast with being merely cogitated or thought, is foreclosed by Hegel’s rule that his construction need justify itself through nothing but “the presentation of the system itself.” Thus we have the case of the magically disappearing world.

 

And so not only God is booted out of Hegel’s system; but also any sense of “objective reality.” The “world” is drawn into the sorcerer’s consciousness as conceptualizations only, as Gestalten, “shapes.” Once the sorcerer possesses the historical “shapes” in his consciousness, he has no further need of “the world,” of evidence from the side of actual experience of the world. Thus he intends to “eclipse” such experience by the force of reason alone, dispensing with human existential experience altogether through the power of “magical” imagination — which of course altogether destroys any avenue of critical judgment from the side of First Reality, which happily satisfies criterion (2) above.

 

Second of all, we need to appreciate the worldview implicit in Hegel’s remarks. Voegelin thinks the above-quoted passage — i.e., “Every single man is but a blind link in the chain of absolute necessity….” — reveals Hegel’s intense resentment of the human condition as well as its cause. Further, it is a key passage for understanding the diremption — meaning the tearing apart, or violent separation from all former historical notions of the human condition so characteristic of modern existence — at the foundation of Hegel’s enterprise:

 

“Man has become a nothing; he has no reality of his own; he is a blind particle in a process of the world which has the monopoly of real reality and real meaning. [Note it is not the world that has meaning; only its process has meaning.] In order to raise himself from nothing to something, the blind particle must become a seeing particle. But even if the particle has gained sight, it sees nothing but the direction in which the process is moving…. And yet, to Hegel something important has been gained: the nothing that has raised itself to a something has become, if not a man, at least a sorcerer who can evoke, if not the reality of history, at least its shape. I almost hesitate to continue — the spectacle of a nihilist stripping himself to the nude is embarrassing. For Hegel betrays in so many words that being a man is not enough for him; and as he cannot be the divine Lord of history himself, he is going to achieve Herrschaft [i.e., dominion, lordship, mastery, rule, reign] as the sorcerer who will conjure up an image of history — a shape, a ghost — that is meant to eclipse the history of God’s making. The imaginative project of history falls in its place in the pattern of modern existence as the conjurer’s instrument of power”….

 

Since the conjurer’s instrument of power is in this case to be obtained by the “perfection” of philosophy into a system of absolute knowledge, we need to define what philosophy is. The etymology of the word tells you the meaning of philosophy is “love of wisdom”: In the original Greek, philo refers to “love” or “lover”; sophia to “wisdom.”

 

Hegel’s main project, as it turns out, was to transform philosophy, the love of wisdom, into an instrument of Absolute Science, whereby “wisdom,” and all knowledge, are found to consist, not in the loving search or quest for divine truth, the complete possession of which is denied to mortal men in this lifetime; but in the  “final possession” of absolute truth once and for all — the “absolute science” that can make men “immortal” in this world. In short, Hegel would like to transform philosophy into an exact science.

 

But if this were possible, then philosophy would instantly cease to be philosophy.

 

For although the insights of philosophy can advance, it cannot advance beyond its structure as “love of wisdom.” In the great tradition of the classical Greeks, eminently Plato and Aristotle (which Hegel had thoroughly mastered), philosophy denotes the loving tension of man “toward the divine ground of his existence. God alone has sophia, ‘real knowledge’; man finds the truth about God and the world, as well as of his own existence, by becoming philosophos, the lover of God and his wisdom. The philosopher’s eroticism implies the humanity of man and the divinity of God as the poles of his existential tension. The practice of philosophy in the Socratic–Platonic sense is the equivalent of the Christian sanctification of man; it is the growth of the image of God in man. Hegel’s harmless-sounding phrase [ i.e., philosophy must at last “give up its name of a love of wisdom and become real knowledge”] thus covers the program of abolishing the humanity of man; the sophia of God can be brought into the orbit of man only by transforming man into God. The Ziel [goal] of the Phänomenologie is the creation of the man-god….” — commencing with Hegel’s own self-deification as the redeemer of mankind now that the history of mankind, and notably his spiritual history, has been abolished by Hegel’s system of absolute science.[6]

 

In this, Hegel reveals his profound alienation from the idea of an established order of the universe. Indeed, he outright rejects any idea of order that has an origin other than in human consciousness, which he hypostasizes as “reason” or at least a facsimile thereof that the sorcerer can put over on his audience.

 

Voegelin provides some helpful insights into the consciousness of the sorcerer and his project:

 

“…Hegel experiences his state of alienation as an acute loss of reality, and even as death. But he cannot, or will not, initiate the movement of return; the epistrophe, the periagoge, is impossible. The despair or lostness, then, turns into the mood of revolt. Hegel closes his existence in on himself; he develops a false self; and lets his false self engage in an act of self-salvation that is meant to substitute for the periagoge of which his true self proves incapable. The alienation which, as long as it remains a state of lostness in open existence, can be healed through the return [to God], now hardens into the acheronta movebo of the sorcerer who, through magic operations, forces salvation from the non-reality of his lostness. Since, however, nonreality has no power of salvation, and Hegel’s true self knows this quite well, the false self must take the next step and, by ‘the energy of thinking,’ transform the reality of God into the dialectics of his consciousness: the divine power accrues to the Subjeckt that is engaged in self-salvation through reaching the state of reflective self-consciousness. If the soul cannot return to God, God must be alienated from himself and drawn into the human state of alienation. And finally, since none of these operations in Second Reality would change anything in the surrounding First Reality, but result only in the isolation of the sorcerer from the rest of society, the whole world must be drawn into the imaginary Second Reality. The sorcerer becomes the savior of the ‘age’ by imposing his System of Science as the new revelation on mankind at large. All mankind must join the sorcerer in the hell of his damnation.”[7]

 

In classical Greek philosophy, and especially in Plato, the epistrophe or periagoge in the above passage refers to the “turning around” to God (the transcendent Beyond of the cosmos) in open existence, in loving response to His call. The terms are analogous to the Christian “born again” experience. The term acheronta movebo means “If I cannot bend the Higher Powers, I will move the Infernal Regions.” It is the satanic declaration of the sorcerer who chooses to close all of reality in on himself, the Subjekt. Given the classical experience, this can only be a system of anti-philosophy.

 

In [Plato’s] Republic, the Beyond is imagined as the ultimate creative ground, the Agathon, from whom all being things receive their existence, their form, and their truth; and since by its presence it is the origin of reality and the sunlike luminosity of its structure, the Agathon-Beyond is something more beautiful and higher in rank of dignity and power that the reality that we symbolize by such terms as being, existence, essence, form, intelligibility, and knowledge. In the myth of the Phaedrus, then, the Beyond is the truly immortal divinity from whose presence in contemplative action the Olympian gods derive their divine and men their human immortality. In the puppet myth of the Laws, finally, ‘the god’ becomes the divine force that pulls the golden cord of the Nous that is meant to move man toward the immortalizing, noetic order of his existence. In this last image of the noetic “pull” (helkein) Plato comes so close to the helkein of the Gospel of John (6:44) that it is difficult to discern the difference.[8]

 

It appears that Hegel’s “revolt” is above all finally a revolt against, a rejection of the human condition, of the fact that a human being is never consulted about the terms of his coming into the world, nor of his departure from it. It is the essence of the human condition that a man is neither the origin nor the “end” of himself — “end” in the sense of telos, meaning purpose, or goal. Meanwhile, in between birth and death, there is a litany of evils to which mortal human nature is subject. “The life of man is really burdened,” as Voegelin put it, “with the well-known miseries enumerated by Hesoid. We remember his list of hunger, hard work, disease, early death, and the fear of the injustices to be suffered by the weaker man at the hands of the more powerful — not to mention the problem of Pandora.”[9]

 

Notwithstanding, Voegelin reminds us that “as long as our existence is undeformed by phantasies, these miseries are not experienced as senseless. We understand them as the lot of man, mysterious it is true, but as the lot he has to cope with in the organization and conduct of his life, in the fight for survival, the protection of his dependents, and the resistance to injustice, and in his spiritual and intellectual response to the mystery of existence.”[10]

 

Now the “lot of man” as just given is a description of the condicio humana, the human condition. It is the very basis for the idea of a universal, common humanity, of the brotherhood of mankind. It is my conjecture that it is possible for a person to take great umbrage at this condicio humana, to deplore and reject it, to see it as a grievous insult to one’s own assumed personal autonomy; and so to take flight in an alternative reality that can be structured more according to one’s own wishes, tastes, and desires. And thus, a Second Reality is born.

 

As for me, all things considered, I’ll take First Reality, the Great Hierarchy of Being — God–Man–World–Society — any day, any time. I believe that human beings were put in this world to be creative actors, even if they never get to design the stage on which the acting is being done, nor to control the writing of the script by which the play unfolds. And meanwhile they not only act, but suffer the actions of other actors or forces — personal, natural, social — from outside themselves.

 

Yet to recognize all this is to recognize the very basis of one’s own existential humanity. And to realize that the lot of any other man is no different. To be part and participant of this divinely constituted, dynamic “sub-whole” of a yet greater Whole is a glorious privilege. To go hole up in a Second Reality, to me, would be to lose one’s reason and probably one’s soul as well….

 

Indeed, that appears to be the conclusion reached by Charles Baudelaire (1821–1867), the great French poet, a noetically and spiritually sensitive person who understood himself to be living in an age of great noetic and spiritual disorder:

 

“A man who does not accept the conditions of life, sells his soul.”

 

And he penned these lines that make it crystal-clear to whom our soul is to be sold:

 

Sur l’oreiller du mal c’est Satan Trismégiste

Qui berce longuement notre esprit enchanté,

Et le riche metal de notre volonté

Est tout vaporiseé par ce savant chimiste

 

C'est le Diable qui tient les fils qui nous remuent.[11]

 

 

[“On the pillow of evil is Satan Trismegistus

Who long lulls our minds delighted,

And the rich metal of our will

Everything is vaporized by the scientist chemist.

 

“It is the devil who holds the son who we move.”]

 

 

 



[1] Eric Vöegelin, “On Hegel: A Study in Sorcery,” Collected Works Vol. 12, 1990.

[2] Ibid.

[3] G. W. F. Hegel, MS, Fortsetzung des “Systems der Sittlichkeit,” c. 1804–06.

[4] Karl Marx, Doctoral Dissertation, 1840–41 (quoting a passage from Aeschylus’ Prometheus Bound).

[5] Karl Marx, “National Ökonomie und Philosophy,” Der Historische Materialismus: Die Früschriften.

[6] Eric Vöegelin, “On Hegel,” op. cit.

[7] Ibid.

[8] Ibid.

[9] Eric Vöegelin, “Wisdom and the Magic of the Extreme,” Collected Works, Vol. 12, 1990.

[10] Ibid.

[11] Charles Baudelaire, “Au lecteur,” introducing the Fleurs du Mal, 1857.

©2008 Jean F. Drew


TOPICS: History; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: atheism; hegel; obama; secondrealities
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 241-258 next last
To: Alamo-Girl
But that caveman knows nothing of information, signal processing, broadcasting. He is quite wrong. Correlation is not causation.

This is the most productive line of epistemology. How well do you know it?

121 posted on 11/17/2008 12:25:31 AM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 117 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; betty boop
Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc

A common logical fallacy indeed. A person sees that B follows A and leaps to the conclusion that A causes B and that to eliminate A is to eliminate B.

Correlation is not causation.

122 posted on 11/17/2008 7:10:00 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 120 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; betty boop
This is the most productive line of epistemology. How well do you know it?

LOLOL!

Years ago we had a rather illuminating discussion of knowledge. More specifically, how we know what we know and how certain we are that we know it. As it turns out, the answers are quite personal.

The survey among science, philosophy and theology posters revealed why certain positions are both irreconcilable and contentious:

Freeper Investigation: What kinds of "Knowledge" exist, and how "certain" are the various types?


123 posted on 11/17/2008 7:17:22 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 121 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl
Years ago we had a rather illuminating discussion of knowledge. More specifically, how we know what we know and how certain we are that we know it. As it turns out, the answers are quite personal.

Louis de Broglie showed us that everything is a wave. Your reference to signals and noise suggests you may be familiar with his work.

124 posted on 11/17/2008 9:01:11 AM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 123 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; betty boop
Louis de Broglie showed us that everything is a wave. Your reference to signals and noise suggests you may be familiar with his work.

Indeed, I am more drawn to quantum field theory than particle physics. And more specifically, to geometric physics (Vafa, Wesson et al.)

The absence of evidence so far in the search for the Higgs field/boson (though CERN might be able to accomplish the feat with it’s new equipment) – puts the emphasis on such theories. After all, a field exists at all points in space/time and therefore the more fundamental structure is space/time itself.

In Wesson’s five dimensional relativity, two times – the particles observed in our four dimensional space/time could be multiply imaged from as little as a single particle in a fifth time-like dimension. Others theorized that it is possible the particles we observe are all actually massless, their apparent masses corresponding to extra-dimensional momentum components we can’t as yet detect.

Of particular interest to me are theories which involve more than one dimension of time.

Moreover, advances in information theory and molecular biology evidence the difference between what is life v non-life/death in nature. Information is the reduction of uncertainty (Shannon entropy) in the receiver (or molecular machine) in going from a before state to an after state. It is the action not the message (e.g. DNA or RNA.) The message survives, when there is no successful communication, there is death or non-life.

We have discussed these points many times on the forum, e.g. here. And they are more thoroughly explored in betty boop and my book Don’t let science get you down, Timothy..

125 posted on 11/17/2008 9:21:47 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 124 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl

Sometimes I feel as if I am a stupid frog in the presence of angelic, all-knowing birds.


126 posted on 11/17/2008 9:40:22 AM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 125 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; betty boop
Sometimes I feel as if I am a stupid frog in the presence of angelic, all-knowing birds.

LOLOL! Either you've read Max Tegmark's Level IV Universe model or you've read our book - because the frog/bird metaphor is built into the dialog.

But I dare say that your raising the points you have been raising is much closer to Einstein's position in the great Plato/Aristotle debate - Einstein argued like a frog but had the instinct of a bird. His dream was to transmute the base wood of matter to the pure marble of geometry. But he just could seem to let go of local realism.

127 posted on 11/17/2008 9:48:28 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 126 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; betty boop
Oops, "But he just could seem to let go of local realism." should be "But he just could not seem to let go of local realism."
128 posted on 11/17/2008 9:50:10 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl

If de Broglie is right and everything is a wave, then wave mechanics controls everything. Do you accept natural selection on any level?


129 posted on 11/17/2008 12:31:20 PM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl; Woebama
A-G to Woebama: Thank you oh so very much for that wonderful quote!!!

Talk about "making man the measure!" And the ensuing reduction of the splendor of creation to the size of a twisted man's psyche.

Chesterton illuminates such phenomena so magnificently.

Thank you both so very much for your splendid insights!

130 posted on 11/17/2008 2:31:30 PM PST by betty boop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 118 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl; PasorBob; the_conscience; Woebama; weston; Mad Dawg; r9etb; spirited irish; ...
RE: The Fallacy of Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc: “After this, therefore because of this.”

A-G wrote: “A common logical fallacy indeed. A person sees that B follows A and leaps to the conclusion that A causes B…. [Yet] Correlation is not causation.”

PasorBob suggested: “This is the most productive line of epistemology.”

I hope you won’t mind if I weigh in with my two cents worth here, but it seems to me that Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc is the fundamental presupposition of science, and needfully so because science’s entire methodology is based on the law of cause and effect.

But this “most productive line of inquiry” has its limitation: It only works in serial time — a time concept of an irreversible “arrow of time,” a chain of moments ineluctably moving from past to present to future.

Indeed, this is the fundamental time concept of classical (Newtonian) physics, which gives such a splendid account of “the way the world works” from within the perspective of four-dimensional reality — three dimensions of space and one of time — that human observers naturally perceive.

But then came the two great revolutions of twentieth-century physics: relativity and quantum theory. Both gave rise to problems that seemingly could not be answered on the serial time model.

For instance, in relativity theory you have the problem of time dilation/contraction, depending on the relative positions of different observers “comparing notes.” If time were merely the accretion of a series of sequential “steps” or moments, such data would be inexplicable. The very fact that the time reports of different, separated observers differ based on their spatio-temporal locations with respect to each other strongly suggests to me that the very idea of time must be something more fundamental, something more basic, that can comprehend and reconcile the differing time reports.

In quantum theory, you have the problems of non-locality and superposition. The “arrow of time,” mechanistic cause-and-effect model of Newtonian physics simply doesn’t seem to apply as well as we could wish in the quantum world.

I’ve recently read statements from scientists within the physics community to the effect that the burgeoning mountains of research data thus far accumulated may be inexplicable on the serial time model, that some new time concept may be necessary before these data can be profitably analyzed and understood.

And so people like Vafa and Wesson have been trying to develop theories regarding the time “structure” (and so space structure — remember that Einstein reconciles the two as complementary expressions of a fundamental unity) that might help to open up the theoretical landscape.

I particularly admire Wesson’s Five Dimensional/Two Times speculation. It adds to the 4D model a fifth temporal (or maybe better to say, “timelike”) dimension, which in essence is the universal temporal matrix — the “eternal now” from our point of view — which involves and accommodates all the spatiotemporal operations in the 4D world, and in relation to which serial time as experienced in 4D stands as its lower-dimensional expression.

I get some encouragement for such speculations from Plato. For he it was who first noticed that man lives “at the intersection of time and timelessness” (as T. S. Eliot so eloquently put it) of that which ever changes, and that which never does.

Perhaps people are perplexed by this idea of timelessness; but human experience universally testifies to its reality to the degree that it acknowledges the reality of universals. Examples of universals would be such things as mathematics and the laws of physics. They are timeless in the sense that they obtain everywhere and at all times, regardless of the particular spatiotemporal configuration in which they become relevant, and regardless of the personal proclivities of the observers who may be on the scene.

A-G and PasorBob, I’ve so enjoyed this conversation between the two of you! Thank you so very much for your extraordinarily stimulating essay/posts!

131 posted on 11/17/2008 5:40:44 PM PST by betty boop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 122 | View Replies]

To: betty boop
But this “most productive line of inquiry” has its limitation: It only works in serial time — a time concept of an irreversible “arrow of time,” a chain of moments ineluctably moving from past to present to future.

If de Broglie is correct, time becomes a problem. Waves do not exist in the instant that is "now". Waves are spread over time. Frequency and wave length (inverses) disappear when measured in Planck time.

132 posted on 11/17/2008 6:01:06 PM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 131 | View Replies]

To: betty boop
"But this “most productive line of inquiry” has its limitation: It only works in serial time "

Quantum wierdness confuses many, but an arrow of time isn't impacted

133 posted on 11/17/2008 6:08:30 PM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 131 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob; Alamo-Girl; the_conscience; Woebama; weston; Mad Dawg; r9etb; spirited irish
Frequency and wave length (inverses) disappear when measured in Planck time.

But Planck time is a pure abstraction. It is a useful unit for scientific calculation which bears no practical relevance for direct, lived human experience/observation outside of the "artificial" scientific construct in which it clearly is useful.

The other thing about Planck length (space)/Planck time which is really nasty is that anything "smaller" than its minimalist measure either (1) conceivably doesn't exist; or (2) human observers cannot say whether or not it exists, because anything "smaller" than the Planck measures is undetectable by the human mind.

Not to detract from the superlative genius of Max Planck here, heaven forfend. I only want to point out that in his context/construct, he was "doing" science, not life.

134 posted on 11/17/2008 6:41:30 PM PST by betty boop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 132 | View Replies]

To: Alamo-Girl

Dearest sister in Christ, I was not confused by the omission! And I think your observation about Einstein’s difficulty in letting to of “local realism” is spot-on.


135 posted on 11/17/2008 6:45:45 PM PST by betty boop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies]

To: PasorBob
BTW, I do not disagree with Voegelin or you in an absolute sense. You both may be correct. I just don’t see how you could ever know if you are correct or not based on your epistemological methodology.

Based on my "epistemological methodology?" Okay. Do you have a better one? If you do, I'm all ears!

Seriously.

BTW, I'm really glad you're here at FR, as an officially registered member and poster! Thank you!

136 posted on 11/17/2008 6:54:29 PM PST by betty boop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 119 | View Replies]

To: betty boop
But Planck time is a pure abstraction. It is a useful unit for scientific calculation which bears no practical relevance for direct, lived human experience/observation outside of the "artificial" scientific construct in which it clearly is useful.

Okay. In your human experience, how small is "now"?

137 posted on 11/17/2008 7:14:31 PM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 134 | View Replies]

To: betty boop

Dead reckoning will take you off course eventually. Try shooting the stars. :)


138 posted on 11/17/2008 7:16:17 PM PST by PasorBob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 136 | View Replies]

To: betty boop
I hope you won’t mind if I weigh in with my two cents worth here, but it seems to me that Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc is the fundamental presupposition of science, and needfully so because science’s entire methodology is based on the law of cause and effect.

No, post hoc ergo propter hoc is not the fundamental presupposition of science. Post hoc is referring to nothing more than the supposition that because B follows A in time, B must have been caused by A. The reason this fallacy seems to carry weight in the mind of the one committing it is that familiarity with actual cause and effect, in which the effect truly follows the cause (because, all talk about quantum this or that notwithstanding, that's the only way it could happen given the general nature of time), has made such a belief easy to entertain. The fallacy of post hoc is a fallacy because it relies on nothing other than temporal succession to claim causation. For instance, to say that because it became apparent that Sheila was pregnant some time after having had sex with Tom, Tom must have impregnated Mary is an example of post hoc ergo propter hoc. To say, though, after it became apparent that Sheila was pregnant that, absent an instance of artificial insemination, she necessarily had to have had sex with some man is not an example of post hoc because it is not relying on the appearance of a relationship but upon the knowledge that certain effects must have certain identifiable causes.
139 posted on 11/17/2008 7:34:58 PM PST by aruanan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 131 | View Replies]

To: betty boop
I believe when God created, He put his creation inside of a time box. God himself is outside of time. From inside the box, we get glimpses of timelessness.
Because God is outside of time, He sees all of time at once. This is why God can foreknow and yet be moved to action by my prayers. It is why I can make bad choices and yet in the future God can make these choices work together for my good. It is why freewill and predestination can both be true. All time is equal to God.
One day when I escape the limitations of my body, I will also leave the boundary of time and step into eternity.
Then I will know as I am known.
140 posted on 11/17/2008 8:25:10 PM PST by weston (As far as I am concerned, it is Christ or nothing!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 134 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 241-258 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson