I don’t like evangelizing? Christ told us to go into the world and preach the “Good News”.
John1:1-2 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Can’t argue the Scriptures. The Word=Christ.
Baptizing is symbolic. The thief on the cross wasn’t baptized and Christ told him “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise”.
As for purgatory, Luke 16:19-31 There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham’, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, becvause I am in agony in this fire.
But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad thing, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.
He answered, ‘Then I beg you father, send Lazarus to my father’s house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’
They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’ ‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them they will repent.’ “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’”
John 14:6 “I am the way, the truth and the life. No one come to the Father except through me.”
The only way you will go to Hell is complete rejection of Christ. I’m not talking about people who haven’t heard the gospel, I’m talking about people who heard and rejected the message of salvation.
As far as being a “lone ranger”, I read the Bible everyday and have not let dogmas get in the way of understanding God’s Word. I grew up in a church and it didn’t hurt me any. I have found that too many churches have lost sight of it’s purpose and have become too political. I don’t need someone else to feed me God’s Word. It’s great that people still want to go to church, but as far as I’m concerned, I don’t need someone forcing their doctrine down my throat especially when it isn’t even scriptural. If it’s in the Bible I believe it, if it isn’t I’m not buying it. I have the Holy Spirit to convict me when I’m doing something wrong. I have so much still to learn and God is continually molding me into the person He wants me to be.
Being Catholic is an organized religion, christians are followers of Christ, not a religion.
I agree that not all who are in the church are christians, but you saying that only true believers are Catholic is very arrogant of you. There’s as many charlatans in the Catholic church as any other. How do you justify all the pedophilia in the Catholic Church, much less the homosexuality? This is what you call the True Church? And I’m not saying that that only happens in the Catholic church. I don’t mean to disparage the Catholic Church but they, like other religions, have their flaws. How many people go to church and don’t even believe in God, much less Christ and His sacrifice on the cross? I’m far from perfect and that’s why I need God. As far as confession goes, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteous”. But I don’t need some Priest, or Pastor, to do that, I can go to my mediator, Christ, and do it. And I don’t tailor anything to my liking. I’m so sick and tired of people passing off doctrine as gospel, I, for one, would not want to lead someone astray with something that is not scripturally based. Just cuz the church says it, don’t make it so. I read God’s word, that’s what He wants me to do so I can apply it to my life, and when the opportunity arises I can share the message of salvation with others.
You wrote:
“I don’t like evangelizing? Christ told us to go into the world and preach the “Good News”.”
I NEVER SAID you didn’t like evangelizing. You wrote: “Paul evangelized in his time, and likewise Christ’s disciples, in Christ’s time on earth. If I didn’t know better I’d say you are trying to be obtuse.” I responded with: “I’d say you’re just trying to ignore what you don’t like.” That wasn’t about evangelization itself. If you’re going to attack my words, then at least make sure you attack what I actually say.
“Baptizing is symbolic. The thief on the cross wasn’t baptized and Christ told him “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise”.”
The fact that Jesus says that does not mean that baptism is symbolic. You are confusing two issues. 1) baptism washes away sins and the Bible says it saves thereby, and 2) the good thief was not baptized but Jesus said he would be paradise with Him that day. Why would you assume that someone who could not be baptized would not be able to be saved by Christ in some other way through His grace filled mercy?
Luke 16:19-31 is about hell, not purgatory. You yourself said so. Why do you repeat the whole story when it does prove anything according to your point?
“The only way you will go to Hell is complete rejection of Christ. I’m not talking about people who haven’t heard the gospel, I’m talking about people who heard and rejected the message of salvation.”
Sin is a rejection of Christ. Schism is a sin. Apostasy is a sin. Heresy is sinful. Now, granted, people may not always be subjectively blameworthy of those things in all instances, but they are all still sinful. And to top it all off is the simple fact that all of us were born stained with sin. Baptism washes away sins - just as St. Paul said.
“As far as being a “lone ranger”, I read the Bible everyday and have not let dogmas get in the way of understanding God’s Word.”
Orthodox dogmas do not get in the way of understanding God’s word. They are the only way to understand God’s word. I have seen Protestants - disagreeing with one another - say baptism is a symbol, others say it is more than that; some say this, some say that. The disagreements are endless. And yet all claim they follow the Bible alone. Imagine that. Have they forgotten what St. Peter said about twisting scripture to their own lusts?
“I grew up in a church and it didn’t hurt me any. I have found that too many churches have lost sight of it’s purpose and have become too political. I don’t need someone else to feed me God’s Word. It’s great that people still want to go to church, but as far as I’m concerned, I don’t need someone forcing their doctrine down my throat especially when it isn’t even scriptural.”
You have made yourself your own church. Now, ask yourself: Was I sent by God to minister to myself?
“If it’s in the Bible I believe it, if it isn’t I’m not buying it.”
I don’t believe that’s what you believe at all. Think about it, no where in the Bible does it say that Matthew wrote the gospel named after him, but I bet you still believe it? You do, don’t you? Show me where in the Bible it says that Matthew’s gospel is inspired by God? Can you point to a single verse that says that? Even one? No, not one. These things are traditions - from the Catholic Church.
“I have the Holy Spirit to convict me when I’m doing something wrong.”
That’s what every Protestant claims, and yet they disagree again and again.
“I have so much still to learn and God is continually molding me into the person He wants me to be.”
And yet you don’t believe He wants you in the Church when He established it?
“Being Catholic is an organized religion, christians are followers of Christ, not a religion.”
Christ organized 12 Apostles. He chose 70 Disciples. He gave them explicit instructions. He did not tell them to make it up on their own. Christ sent an organized Church into the world to evangelize it. He did not send you to make it up as you go along.
“I agree that not all who are in the church are christians, but you saying that only true believers are Catholic is very arrogant of you.”
No. I never said that only true believers are Catholics. I will say - truthfully - that only Catholics are true believers. There is a difference. One cannot be a true believer without being a Catholic for only the Catholic Church teaches the fullness of the truth. There is nothing arrogant in this. It is simply truth. What is arrogant is for a person to think they can make up Christianity on their own and get it right.
“There’s as many charlatans in the Catholic church as any other.”
I do not follow charlatans and have never been fooled by them. I listen to the Church - because Christ speaks through it. Charlatans are in every field. The Church is not changed by charlatans. She is always true because she comes from Christ.
“How do you justify all the pedophilia in the Catholic Church, much less the homosexuality?”
I don’t. Why would I? Why would you think for a single minute that I would justify objectively sinful and disordered behavior?
“This is what you call the True Church?”
No, I do not call pedophilia nor homosexuality the True Church. I call pedophilia and homosexuality sinful and disordered. What do you call them? What I do call the True Church is the True Church. I do not confuse the Church with the sins of its members. We are all sinful. If your brother was a homosexual, I would not think that makes you a liar, or unfaithful or evil. Your brother is the person with the problem, not you. Likewise, I do not blame the Church - which condemns both pedophilia and homosexuality - for the fact that there are pedophiles and homosexuals who abuse people AND THE CHURCH from within her.
“And I’m not saying that that only happens in the Catholic church.”
Oh, no, gee, you’re not saying that at all. Noooooo. You’re instead somehow saying that the Catholic Church is responsible for the sins of her members even when she teaches against their actions!
“I don’t mean to disparage the Catholic Church but they, like other religions, have their flaws.”
No. People have flaws. The Church doesn’t. Christ sent the Church. She has no flaws. Christ (through the Holy Spirit) sent the New Testament. It has no flaws. What it does have is people who twist it and misuse it. See how that works?
“How many people go to church and don’t even believe in God, much less Christ and His sacrifice on the cross?”
Few. Most believe, but many don’t understand properly.
“I’m far from perfect and that’s why I need God. As far as confession goes, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteous”.”
Yes, but that just brings us back to how we confess. Again, John 20:19-23.
“But I don’t need some Priest, or Pastor, to do that, I can go to my mediator, Christ, and do it.”
But your mediator sent the Church for that job when He left this earth. Again, John 20:19-23. That’s exactly what Jesus says, As the Father sent me, I send YOU. He meant the Church.
“And I don’t tailor anything to my liking. I’m so sick and tired of people passing off doctrine as gospel, I, for one, would not want to lead someone astray with something that is not scripturally based.”
Really? I’m sick and tired of people claiming they’re Bible Christians and yet they ignore 2 Tim 4:3
“3For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine.”
You see, the gospel cannot be cut away from sound doctrine. That’s why Paul told Timothy: “Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.”
(1 Tim 4:16) Imagine that! People who persevere in good doctrine will be saved!!! And yet they are not left to make it up themselves nor are they handed copies of the NT (which wasn’t finished yet) to work it out on their own.
St. Paul also wrote to Titus:
He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it. (Titus 1:9)
You must teach what is in accord with sound doctrine. (Titus 2:1)
“Just cuz the church says it, don’t make it so.”
Yeah, actually it does. Again, things from God have no flaw.
“I read God’s word, that’s what He wants me to do so I can apply it to my life, and when the opportunity arises I can share the message of salvation with others.”
No. He sent the Church to teach you. Reading the Bible is great and I do hope you apply it to your life. But most likely you are only applying things you like to your life. Christ did not send you to minister to yourself. He sent the Church. She wrote the scriptures under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. One day you’ll know.