Posted on 07/03/2008 4:58:11 AM PDT by Fr Bernard
The Case for choices within the Roman Catholic Church is a very important not only for the Church Hierarchy but for all catholic people active or lapsed. Fact we have amalgamations and or closing down of churches in Europe and America on a grand scale exception is Poland who have seen a growth both to the Roman Catholic Church and the National Catholic church which Rome does recognise as valid. Anglican Clergy can do a quick conversion course and receive Catholic Orders along with his wife and kids. However if Fr o flattery dares to have an affair out he goes, loss of wages and home as well. However according to one current case of a Dundee Monsignor it is God who pays his wages not the Church so you cannot sue the Church. This is by solicitors acting for dundee diocese. However for myself as a Canon Law Doctor it will be interesting when it goes to the House of Peers. I pray that the good Monsignor will not make public via the tabloids his collections as the Vatican Enforcer but instead write a quality book. I for one as a Roman Catholic priest would love to receive a copy as it will no doubt make some interesting bed or bath time reading. Yes, i do prepare my Sunday sermons in my bath. However it is above the water line before you ask! Priest are men gay or hetro and have desires normal or perhaps not quite so normal depending on your orientation. However priests, pastors or ministers who use their position to molest children or vulnerable people of both sexes know in their heart where they are likely to end up when we cross over that great divide. All churches of all christian brand name should put their house in order over this. Married men with a wife and family is ideal says any church. The Greek, Coptic, Anglican Old Catholic, Russian have them why not in Gods Name can the Roman Catholic have them. Married Priests. God Bless Fr Dr Bernard
Clerical celibacy goes back to patristic times in the Church and, arguably, back to apostolic times. Although the early Church ordained married men, all priests whether married or single were required to practice perfect continence after ordination. That is, married priests were not allowed to have relations with their wives or to father children after ordination. Obviously, this was a difficult rule to enforce, which is why the Catholic Church eventually restricted ordination to single men.
Moreover, at no point in its history did the Church EVER permit priests to marry after ordination and this is true of the Eastern and Orthodox Churches, as well, whose clergy are not permitted to marry.
Those who believe that Catholic priests should be allowed to marry are not asking that the Church return to an earlier tradition because the Church has never permitted priests to marry or remarry after ordination. They are, in fact, asking for the Church to embrace a radically new practice, one that has no basis in Church history and one which would seriously undermine the priest’s identity as someone set apart and consecrated to the service of God and His Church.
Even if the Church decided to permit married men to be ordained, which is highly unlikely since the Holy See recently rejected that idea, it would NEVER allow priests to marry after ordination. Therefore, the men who have left the priesthood in order to marry will never be permitted (thank God!) to resume their priestly ministry. They’ve made their choice, let them live with it.
Fathers. Christian Cochini and Roman Cholij have written excellent books on clerical celibacy. You may want to read them.
Welcome to Free Republic!
If you were a RC priest and canon lawyer you should know why. Sheesh.
I was wondering if this was an IBTZ situation.
Wait till NY’er sees this one.
I doubt you're actually a Roman Catholic priest. Rather, I think you're here to stir up crap. We're not interested. If you're not happy with the current state of Mother Church, the Episcopal Church is right down the hall.
I actually have no problem with the notion of married men being ordained to the priesthood (it is, after all, highly defensible on historical, biblical and theological grounds). HOWEVER, the idea that already-ordained priests can marry after ordination is absolutely novel in the history of the Church and has no defensible precedence in either the Catholic or Orthodox Churches.
What a dunce.
What kind of “canon lawyer” writes like this?
Puh-leaze. One can just TASTE the ozone on this one.
I find it hard to believe a real RC Priest would be so lacking in knowledge on the few number of married Anglican clergy crossing the Tiber. You think it's that easy? You are either misinformed or ignorant.
I think a person of such an opinion would be more at home in FutureChurch than the Catholic Church to which I belong.
Incorrect. The "conversion course"(sic) is not quick and is by no means automatic and the wife and kids do not receive the Sacrament of Holy Orders.
However for myself as a Canon Law Doctor
I for one as a Roman Catholic priest
I call BS. Please post your verifiable CV including contact information for your superior.
If you are a priest you should be dismissed from the clerical state on the grounds of being an ignoramus.
Married men with a wife and family is ideal says any church.
You're ignorant of Scripture as well, "Father".
"But I would have you to be without solicitude. He that is without a wife, is solicitous for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please God. But he that is with a wife, is solicitous for the things of the world, how he may please his wife: and he is divided. And the unmarried woman and the virgin thinketh on the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit. But she that is married thinketh on the things of the world, how she may please her husband. And this I speak for your profit: not to cast a snare upon you; but for that which is decent, and which may give you power to attend upon the Lord, without impediment." 1 Corinthians 7:32-35
The Greek, Coptic, Anglican Old Catholic, Russian have them why not in Gods Name can the Roman Catholic have them.
21 of the 22 Churches sui juris which comprise the Catholic Church ordain, as a norm, married men. Once ordained a single Priest may not then marry and remain in the clerical state, just like the Greek Orthodox. However, if the wife of a Priest or Deacon precedes her husband in death he must then adopt the discipline of celibacy, same as with those married protestant ministers who convert and are ordained under the Pastoral Provision or dispensation. The Latin Rite of the Church chooses to emulate the example of Christ, the Apostles and St. Paul with the discipline of clerical celibacy. If you don't like it, petition the Holy See to dismiss you from the clerical state.
I would think that priests choose celibacy when they take Holy Orders. They don’t become priests and are then told, “By the way, you can never get married.” It’s a choice they make. As for abstaining from meat, giving up meat on wednesdays and fridays as an act of sacrifice is hardly abstaining from meat the way it is suggested in Timothy and being ungrateful for it. In fact, giving up something like meat (which was a luxury in the time lent started, we tend to take it for granted today) is showing gratitude because the point is that you’re supposed to be giving up something good that you enjoy. If meat was bad and you gave it up, it’s hardly a sacrifice, and if it’s evil and we shouldn’t be grateful for it, shouldn’t we be abstaining from it ALL the time? Or is it only evil on certain days of the year? Answer: It’s not evil at all and we should always show gratitude for everything God’s given us.
IBTZ. Paragraphs are our FRiends, as are capital letters, apostrophes, semicolons, and other markers of civilization.
As for sacrifice, it is a deed to please the church, in keeping with the traditions of men. It is not pleasing to God, no more than vain repetitions of "Hail Mary":
And when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words. Matthew 6:7
The bible and Catholicism contradict each other. I'll stick with the bible, thanks.
Pope Defends Clergy Celibacy Order
Has the Time Come to Consider Making Celibacy Truly Optional In the Western Church?
Catholic Scandals: A Crisis for Celibacy?
Celibacy of the priesthood is a church strength, not a liability
Celibacy s history of power and money
Pope: Priests Must Stay Celibate
Giving Thanks for the Good Shepherds ( A Defense of Priestly Celibacy)
Don't end celibacy for priests
The celibate superhero
Priestly Celibacy And Its Roots In Christ
How to Refute Arguments Against Priestly Celibacy
Priestly Celibacy Reflects Who - and Whose - We Are[Father George W.Rutler]
Celibacy
Tracing the Glorious Origins of Celibacy
God’s call to celibacy for the sake of His Kingdom - by Card. George
Vatican Says Celibacy Rule Nonnegotiable
Bishop Attacks Move to End Celibacy
A response to Fr. Joseph Wilson's defense of mandatory celibacy
The gift of Priestly celibacy as a sign of the charity of Christ, by Mother Teresa of Calcutta
Archbishop Dolan:"We Need to Be Renewing Our Pledge to Celibacy, Not Questioning It"
Celibacy is gift cherished by church
Celibacy Will Save the Priesthood
Celibacy Defended by EWTN's Fr. Levis
Call To Action: Dump Celibacy
The (Catholic) Church Has Always Prospered When Celibacy Is Honored
John Paul II Hails "Inestimable Value" of Priestly Celibacy
For Priests, Celibacy Is Not the Problem
Fr. Shannon Collins Discusses Celibacy
5 Arguments Against (Catholic) Priestly Celibacy and How to Refute Them
Why A Married Priesthood Won't Remedy the Priest Shortage
New Vatican Document on Homosexuality and the Priesthood Coming Before Fall 2005
Catholic priests demand the right to marry
Catholic priests urge Church to reconsider celibacy rules
Alternative Priests´ Council Hits Back on Mandatory Celibacy
Married Priests? The English Experience
Saying Yes to God: a Look into Vocations
New Vatican Document to Eliminate 1961 Papal Ban on Ordaining Homosexuals
Saying Yes to God: a Look into Vocations
Is it time to ordain married men to the Catholic priesthood?
40% of Scots priests want end to celibacy
A small, sturdy band of 'John Paul priests'(JPII legacy of conservative priests)
Yes, Gay Men Should Be Ordained
Cardinal says Priests will marry
Fathers, Husbands and Rebels: Married Priests
An Unneeded Headache (Vatican document on [NOT] admitting homosexual to the priesthood)
More (Priestly) Celibacy, Not Less
Vatican Prepares Draft Directives Against Admitting Gays as Priests
From Anglican to married Catholic priest
Spain gets first married priest
Spain (R) Catholic Church ordains first married priest
The Catholic Church - East-West Difference Over Priestly Celibacy
ROMAN CATHOLIC DIOCESE OF SCRANTON TO RECEIVE FIRST ECUSA PRIEST
Defending Chastity in the Priesthood
Ordination of married men is raised at Vatican synod
Patriarch of Venice deemphasizes ordination of married men to the priesthood
Cardinal Pell: Ending Celibacy Rule Would Be a Blunder
Priest shortage stems from crisis of faith, ignorance of the infinite, not celibacy, say Bishops [at Synod]
Vatican synod rules out married priests (for Latin Church)
Synod Affirms Priestly Celibacy
Married Priests Aren’t the Answer (a seminarian states his view)
5 Arguments Against Priestly Celibacy and How to Refute Them
(Catholic) Church makes a clear distinction between chastity and celibacy, says Priest
Why Not Married Priests? The Case for Clerical Celibacy
The biblical foundation of priestly celibacy
Married, ex-Episcopalian ordained a Catholic priest in California
Getting It Right:The Foundation of Friendship (What can a celibate priest really teach us about love
Another One Takes the Plunge [swims the Tiber]
Following the Signs (to a priestly vocation)
That sneaky desperate Catholic Church is at it again
Long Journey to Rome (Former Southern Baptist Pastor Now a Traveling Crusader for Catholic Church)
New, stricter Priestly Formation Program issued for U.S. Catholic seminaries
Ex-Lutheran bishop found Catholic rock: Joseph Jacobson to be ordained Catholic priest by Christmas
Jesuit defends priestly celibacy (a lengthy but worthy read)
The Gift: A Married Priest Looks at Celiba[cy]
Vatican Reaffirms Celibacy for Priests
Pope, Curia Aides Reaffirm Value of Priestly Celibacy (detailed Vatican response)
Vatican Said (Again!) Not Revising Celibacy Rule
On Priests, Marriage and the Sacraments
Should Catholic priests have the right to marry?
Married Priests Back Celibacy (Part 1 of 2)
Messori: Married priests no remedy for “vocations crisis”
Why Celibacy? [Catholic Caucus]
Married man considers turn as Catholic priest
The Nature of Priestly Ordination: Theological Background and Some Present Concerns
Ukrainian cardinal says married men not answer to vocations crisis
Angelo Roncalli (Pope John XXIII) and Priestly Celibacy
Married man considers turn as Catholic priest
Roman Catholic Priests the Case For:
It Takes a Village of Vocations [Part Two of a series on Celibacy] -- Catholic Caucus
Living Single and Celibate in God’s Service [Part Three of a series on Celibacy] -- Catholic Caucus
Brothers and Sisters in Christ [Part Four of a series on Celibacy] -- Catholic Caucus
The Adventure of the Priesthood [Part Five of a series on Celibacy] -- Catholic Caucus
This Is the Body of Christ [Part Six of a series on Celibacy and Vocations] -- Catholic Caucus
If you mean the Dunkeld Diocese-that’s where an errant Priest is sharing a house with his mistress.. a very pricey house, I might add:
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