Very nice post, Joe. And a terrific FReeper page, too. I’m not so much an ecumenicist as a “live and let live” type of person. The acrimony really bothers me, especially when I find myself feeling it, not just reading it. Not that I can’t handle it, just that it’s not what I think God wants for my life.
I’m as vulnerable to insults as the next person. I have many religions among my family and friends in the meat world, and I have never had the experiences with them that I’ve had here.
Apparently, my effort to change the noise to music ratio has been pretty well wasted; nevertheless, I thank you and others on this thread for the quiet, supportive comments.
Life has enough conflict all on its own without adding to it by participating in the crap that goes on, on the religion threads.
Sorry to hear your wife is sick. Please accept my prayers for her speedy return to health, and my prayers for you as you stand by her and your terrific kids.
Thanks so much for the prayers for Mollie, as well as the family. I believe the mother is the heart of the family, and in that regard we have all been impacted by her illness, which remains an undiagnosed mystery. She is getting better though ~ slowly.
I think the term “ecumenism” has 2 meanings. The one I prefer, and the one that I live by, is the “live and let live”. We can get along, as long as you don’t impose on me. The other requires that we change or compromise our faith, in favor of something that is more “harmonious”. False harmony, I might add.
I have good friends who are LDS (I don’t like using the term “Mormon”) and we obviously will never come together on doctrine. We discuss themes and values in our religion where there are similarities.
“my effort to change the noise to music ratio has been pretty well wasted”
I don’t think so. The journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step. Your labor may not immeadiately bring fruit, but hopefully you won’t be flamed. ;0)
God bless.
BTW, those quotes on my homepage are all true!
The newest entry from my daughter in 1st grade;
“A car was driving down the road. Another car was coming out of it’s driveway and the driver wasn’t watching where he was going.”
“The 2 cars had a “collage” together.”
Not wasted at all.
Sadly, it’s Not the improved mutual hearing and respect I was hoping for . . . but not wasted.
Major change takes a lot. Even with willing cooperative clients/family members etc. 100-300 or more repetitions of the new statement, attitude, thought-choice . . . may be required to even begin serious change on deeply engrained, reflexive stuff.
You did Good. Be not weary in well doing (KJV).
I’d also encourage you to avoid leaving at all the msg, spirit, attitude, grace God gave you in that service/mass.
THAT WAS/IS FROM HIM. No amount of flack, chaff, anything need lessen it’s import and efficacy for you.
I’m deeply grieved and sorry that you seemed unable to realize, feel, see that my long post responding to whomever was still in the attitude etc. which you were calling for. That hurt and grieved me significantly.
However, I still believe the grace, msg given to you is quite a worthy one. Where practicable and I can with clear conscience, I’ll persist in trying however I can, to support it hereon.
I have no doubt that others will continue to fail to see that. Thankfully, God has better eyes and better understanding.
I was beginning to form a picture in my mind of a possible way we could more effectively help one another conform better to the image of Christ in all this.
The seeming lack of RC willingness/capacity to meet Prottys half way [not compromising priorities not fitting to compromise] . . . that lack of willingness/capacity trashed the tenuous picture forming in my mind of a possible way out of the briar patch.
It’s just not very workable for Prottys to play ball when it seems glaringly demanded that Prottys become AT LEAST Jr RC’s to be considered tolerable to breathe air and take up space on the same planet.
It’s a bit like the fighting hubby and wife . . . each screaming that if the other would just FIRST become more like the one screaming that the screaming one would THEN be nice.
There can be no dialogue; not even minimal HEARING . . . much less any Love when others are NOT ACCEPTED WHERE THEY ARE, AS THEY ARE. I’m talking persons here, personhood. I’m not talking BELIEFS.
The chronic RC problem of the part of too many RC reps of a wholesale dysfunctional ability to distingish between deeply held beliefs vs person, personhood is an enormous stumblig block. I can accept such individuals in that stance as they are.
However, their stance requires of me a certain type of response. They are unwilling/unable on the one hand to persistently fiercely, brazenly trigger the responses they get AND ACCEPT THEM in any remotely redemptive, constructive way.
Wellllll excuse me. That doesn’t cut it.
Then there’s the personal assaults. 98-100% of the time, now, the brazenly fierce and brazenly overt personal assaults now are from a small group of RC’s to Prottys.
Yet the feeling on the part of many seems to be that it’s 100% the Prottys sabotaging all the sweetness and light? No way. Won’t wash. Never will wash as a valid construction on reality.
It appears to me that many RC’s have been mentally, emotionally, philosophially cloistered inside such narrowly defined walls for so long . . . they go berzerk at the mere thought that any other reality remotely exists to the least degree.
Then appoplexy; dust in the air; rending clothes; screaming personal assaults; abuse button sitting marathons . . . and all the rest break out at the drop of a hat.
And Prottys shake their heads and observe more 2 year old/Jr high level antics by SOME RC’s and figure it will take Christ returning before things will change.
And this foaming at the fingers indignation that Prottys don’t think, perceive, believe like RC’s . . . what’s WITH THAT??? Doing the same thing perseverationally, chronically, obsessively AND EXPECTING A DIFFERENT RESPONSE has been likened to insanity! LOL.
Guess what . . . we’re very different on a number of significant issues.
Yet, somehow, God has us together . . . FOR HIS PURPOSES. Seems to me only the stubbornly clueless and rebellious would resist trying to find out and to walk into whatever that might be on God’s agenda with us in this context.
HINT—IT’S NOT TO BECOME CLONES OF ONE ANOTHER OR OF ONE SIDE OR THE OTHER.
It’s also not to become some milque toast homoginized, wattered down version of the other side or some such compromise of the two. Not in the cards. Not God’s agenda.
He did NOT make us Wal-Mart machine-stamped/molded plastic specials from some Heavenly China.
LUB,