Posted on 02/25/2008 1:28:16 AM PST by Manfred the Wonder Dawg
In reading an article and listening to the embedded video found here: http://www.apprising.org/archives/2008/02/roman_catholic.html
I was led to the Vatican web site to verify some of the statements made on the video. The fellow on the video is not a charismatic speaker, but his material is most interesting - and his passion for TRUTH reaches a wonderful crescendo at 54 minutes into the video.
The following extract from Vatican II shows that the RCC considers Hinduism, Buddhism, & Islam as valid religions through which one can find peace with God. Of course, there are some Truths tossed in to disarm the casual reader.
That's all I have to say, except read the Vatican's material for your self and ask the Lord for wisdom and discernment:
From Vatican II:
http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_decl_19651028_nostra-aetate_en.html
2. From ancient times down to the present, there is found among various peoples a certain perception of that hidden power which hovers over the course of things and over the events of human history; at times some indeed have come to the recognition of a Supreme Being, or even of a Father. This perception and recognition penetrates their lives with a profound religious sense.
Religions, however, that are bound up with an advanced culture have struggled to answer the same questions by means of more refined concepts and a more developed language. Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men. Indeed, she proclaims, and ever must proclaim Christ "the way, the truth, and the life" (John 14:6), in whom men may find the fullness of religious life, in whom God has reconciled all things to Himself.(4)
The Church, therefore, exhorts her sons, that through dialogue and collaboration with the followers of other religions, carried out with prudence and love and in witness to the Christian faith and life, they recognize, preserve and promote the good things, spiritual and moral, as well as the socio-cultural values found among these men.
3. The Church regards with esteem also the Moslems. They adore the one God, living and subsisting in Himself; merciful and all- powerful, the Creator of heaven and earth,(5) who has spoken to men; they take pains to submit wholeheartedly to even His inscrutable decrees, just as Abraham, with whom the faith of Islam takes pleasure in linking itself, submitted to God. Though they do not acknowledge Jesus as God, they revere Him as a prophet. They also honor Mary, His virgin Mother; at times they even call on her with devotion. In addition, they await the day of judgment when God will render their deserts to all those who have been raised up from the dead. Finally, they value the moral life and worship God especially through prayer, almsgiving and fasting. Since in the course of centuries not a few quarrels and hostilities have arisen between Christians and Moslems, this sacred synod urges all to forget the past and to work sincerely for mutual understanding and to preserve as well as to promote together for the benefit of all mankind social justice and moral welfare, as well as peace and freedom.
I forgot to mention - here’s a Catholic web site that makes the same point about Vatican II: http://www.cmri.org/94prog6.htm
IMHO, it’s simpler to say no.
I agree that it’s simpler to “just say no”, but it seemed important to cite and quote source documents showing the errors many claim don’t exist.
read later -
Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions.
"Proposing ways...sacred rites?" Just more dead-ended works.
What is "true and holy" in these religions?
But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven." -- Matthew 10:32-33"Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
If God chooses to save a man who denies Christ by being a Buddhist or an Hindu, it will certainly not be because his belief is "true and holy," but because God chooses to save that man in spite of the fact his religion is a lie from Satan that denies Jesus Christ.
If a Christian faith doesn't get that one right, what's left to get?
The subtlety is in the entire message. Catholics respect other religions and seek to work with them not annhililate them with jihad.
The church also sees them as knowing a partial truth of God, and the Catholic church as having the full truth.
One line from one document doesn’t give the whole story, which is why arguing with bible verses is nonsense...you can prove anything by doing that...you need to read the bible as a whole and put it into context on how the teaching bishops taught it for two thousand years.
Sorry, my comment wasn’t directed at yourself, as much as it was in response to the authors of the original ecumenicalism.
I agree that it’s good to point out from the sources those errors which IMHO, cause so much more confusion for both believer and unbeliever alike.
Well, that’s an eye opener. Those who lie down with dogs will get up with fleas, I guess. I doubt most Catholics know or even agree with this. Hmmm.
They believe that they must conquer the world by the sword and turn it over to Allah. The Roman church is dead wrong on this ! Allah is the Evil One, haSatan.Their core belief is to murder the Saturday people then the Sunday people.
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai
The following extract from Vatican II shows that the RCC considers Hinduism, Buddhism, & Islam as valid religions through which one can find peace with God
No, that's your take on it.
What do you mean by the term "valid religion"? (NB, the catechism never used that term. It's your term, not theirs.) Nor does the catechism ever say that those religions guarantee, or even offer, "peace with God".
Catholicism has always recognized that all other religions are mixtures of truth and error.
Truth is truth, whether you hear it from a Muslim, or a Buddhist, or a Protestant, or a Catholic.
Do you agree? Because if you don't, we can stop right there because our understandings of truth are fundamentally incompatible.
To the extent that, e.g., Islam teaches the truth, that's a good thing and we can rejoice in it, just as I can rejoice when you teach something that is true. And truth, even if taught by a Muslim, can be an aid to someone's salvation, simply by virtue of the fact that it comes from God who is the source of truth. Does that mean that all Muslims are saved? No, actually we can't be sure that any Muslims are saved. On the other hand, we should trust in the mercy of God, and hope for it to be extended even to those whom we can't reach.
Ditto for everyone else.
Do you want to know where this comes from in the Bible? Paul in the Areopagus, Acts chapter 17.
I don’t agree with this as it is unbiblical. Sounds like doctrines created by Liberation Theologians and liberals.
Which God won't do, since He has clearly stated that there is no other name under heaven given among men, whereby man we must be saved (Acts.4:12) and that ye must be born again.(Jn.3:7).
If anyone wants to understand how God deals with those who haven't heard the Gospel, they only need to read the Book of Jonah, Acts 16 and Rom.1.
The man has been dead almost 3 years! Give it a rest!
Excellent picture! Shows that the popes are not “vicars of Christ”: the Lord Jesus would NOT coddle up to such.
But not all truths are of equal value or equal import or equal consequence. The fact that the grass is green may be a truth, but its value is of little eternal consequence.
Does that mean that all Muslims are saved? No, actually we can't be sure that any Muslims are saved. On the other hand, we should trust in the mercy of God, and hope for it to be extended even to those whom we can't reach. Ditto for everyone else. Do you want to know where this comes from in the Bible? Paul in the Areopagus, Acts chapter 17.
Well then let's look at Chaper 17:
"22Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious. 23For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you. 24God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; 25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; 26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; 27That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: 28For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. 29Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device. 30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead. 32And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked:"
Just how are the Muslims doing with that indispensible truth in verses 30-31? How are they doing with that repentance and Resurrection part?
Perhaps instead of massaging them into their illusory complacency with its eternal consequences, they should be told that God's not winking at their nor anyone else's ignorance anymore.
>>The man has been dead almost 3 years! Give it a rest!<<
So, what somoene does when they’re alive ceases to influence people, or have any relevance after they’re dead? If that’s the case, Rome is in trouble since their religion is built on the traditions of men who have been dead much longer than a few years!
Rome is complicit in the very ecumenism (among other things) that blurs the lines of Biblical truth. JP II kissing the Koran shows this. To my knowledge, he never repented of this act, so he’s just as guilty of embracing the works of darkness (Ephesians 5) as anyone else who does the same.
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