***No, there are many pastors, priests, and Bishops of all faiths who never had true faith in the first place. There is nothing magic about a vocation that guarantees true faith. Falling away permanently is strong evidence that there was no faith originally, or else Christ is a liar.***
1 Cor 9:
25
Every athlete exercises discipline in every way. They do it to win a perishable crown, but we an imperishable one.
26
Thus I do not run aimlessly; I do not fight as if I were shadowboxing.
27
No, I drive my body and train it, for fear that, after having preached to others, I myself should be disqualified.
Paul is saying here that if he falters, he might not attain salvation. No problem with Christ’s message, or Paul’s.
***Are you saying that the elect will suffer here on Earth to one degree or another, but you cannot tell if it is God’s doing or not?
Sometimes, yes. A hardship can be a discipline from God, or it could be God allowing satan to act for other reasons. Sometimes it is reasonably easy to tell the difference, but sometimes not.***
I don’t see it. Do you have examples?
***Mark quoting: Matt 10:22 You will be hated by all because of my name, but whoever endures to the end will be saved.
This means that it is possible to fall away. Notice the sentence structure - the condition is enduring to the end, and the result is salvation. The Reformed reverse cause and effect and say that the salvation comes first and the result is endurance to the end.
It doesn’t mean that, it is simply a true statement. By your reading Jesus sent out the twelve all alone: “Go at it and do your best, maybe I will see you in Heaven depending on how well you do”. Jesus doesn’t do that. The message of Christ is that He will ALWAYS be with them, even to the very end of the age. If anything, the Apostolic reading here is a criticism of Jesus.***
Hardly a criticism. Understanding. The verse says that those who remain until the end will be saved. Cause and effect. If 1) endure, then 2) saved. Not vice versa.
Another true statement, but not indicating that he doesn't have assurance. He displays the correct mindset of Christians. That is, do NOT rely on the plain meaning of OSAS. God has plans for us and commands us to obey Him. That does not stop at the point of belief. Paul affirms that perseverance must happen, but does not get into the theology of the mechanism here.
FK: Sometimes, yes. A hardship can be a discipline from God, or it could be God allowing satan to act for other reasons. Sometimes it is reasonably easy to tell the difference, but sometimes not.***
I don’t see it. Do you have examples?
Sure, take the two we just talked about recently, AIDS and 9/11. COULD those have been God's wrath against certain people? Yes, "possibly", but we can't know for sure. There is a precedent with Sodom and Gomorrah, but again we can't declare it one way or the other. An easier example would be like me stealing a $5 item from work with no chance of being caught. Then I get caught and they fire me. I would consider it highly likely that it was because of God as a discipline.
[Re: Matt 10:22] The verse says that those who remain until the end will be saved. Cause and effect. If 1) endure, then 2) saved. Not vice versa.
This verse is simply a true statement and uses "saved" in the future tense. I thought Catholics agree that the Bible also uses "save" in the present tense. That would be before any enduring is done. (You are arguing that one can lose his salvation, meaning he already had it.) So, we have to be careful about which sense of "save" we are talking about. Therefore, in the totality of scriptures, my contention that those who are saved WILL endure is just as reasonable.