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To: stfassisi; kosta50; aruanan; MarkBsnr; Dr. Eckleburg; irishtenor
In other words you seem convinced that God has ordained your sin ,and because you believe in God it does not matter what you do because you believe in God?

God ordains everything in His plan, and that has necessarily involved the sin of others as we are told in the Bible. I have already detailed that what people do matters because God ordains actions within time. So, what we do matters since what God ordains must happen.

If this is what you believe, it is the devil's trap,Dear Brother?

I'm afraid I don't know what you mean by "devil's trap". God ordains that some if not all sin happens, but He author's none of it. It goes back to the duty your side places on God. We place no duty upon God to protect man from his own sin nature.

I have a missionary friend(who is a very humble holy man) in Madagascar who does exorcisms and converts pagans.He has written me that this type of belief is what the devil uses to gain souls.

What, the devil uses the idea that God is sovereign and ordains what He wants to happen in order to get souls over to satan's side? Hmmm. I'm not sure how much sense that makes. I would say that the devil would much rather have men think that they are the ones who are sovereign and self-determined to be able to choose God (or not) from their own inner devices. Wouldn't it be much easier for satan to attack a man who thinks that HE himself is the captain of his own ship rather than a man who knows that God is the captain of his ship? I would think so. In my experience satan often if not always takes the path of least resistance. When I really blow it are the same times I am doing things my own way, forgetting that God is sovereign and in control.

Kosta pointed out the beatitude's in posts #5884 to Dr E . If we cannot grasp them,than our Salvation is in trouble.

The Beatitudes show us the fruits of salvation. God promises that He will continue the good work that He began in His children. True Christians WILL look like the Beatitudes.

Here is a wonderful article on them by Fulton Sheen..

Let Him come into the world which denies Absolute Truth, which says that right and wrong are only questions of point of view, that we must be broad- minded about virtue and vice, and let Him say to them, “Blessed are they who hunger and thirst after holiness,” that is, after the Absolute, after the Truth which “I am”; and they will in their broad-mindedness give the mob the choice of Him or Barabbas; they will crucify Him with thieves, and try to make the world believe that God is no different from a batch of robbers who are His bedfellows in death.

Thanks for the article, and a special AMEN to this part. :) Much of the world doesn't believe in absolutes any more.

Let Him come into a world which tries to interpret man in terms of sex; which regards purity as coldness, chastity as frustrated sex, self- containment as abnormality, and the union of husband and wife until death as boredom; which says that a marriage endures only so long as the glands endure, that one may unbind what God binds and unseal what God seals.

And in light of recent conversation in general, a double special Amen to this! :)

6,022 posted on 06/01/2008 9:53:45 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: Forest Keeper; stfassisi; kosta50; aruanan; MarkBsnr; Dr. Eckleburg

Here is a question for all of you...

How would you handle Acts 2:22-23? I make note of this because it was the basis for the sermon today at church.


6,025 posted on 06/01/2008 10:43:46 PM PDT by irishtenor (Check out my blog at http://boompa53.blogspot.com/)
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To: Forest Keeper; stfassisi; aruanan; MarkBsnr; Dr. Eckleburg; irishtenor
So, what we do matters since what God ordains must happen

Then what we do is not our will but God's will. And if ti is not our will then it is not our responsibility.

We place no duty upon God to protect man from his own sin nature.

No, God has no duty to protect, as long as you admit that in the Reformed theology God created man with the specific intent to be evil and that, by the will of this Reformed "God" man is evil by design and not by choice.

Wouldn't it be much easier for satan to attack a man who thinks that HE himself is the captain of his own ship rather than a man who knows that God is the captain of his ship?

No, because a man who believes that God ordains good as well as evil will be unable to discern what is from God and what is from Satan.

The Beatitudes show us the fruits of salvation

False. The Beatitudes tell us what we must do and what we must be like in order to be saved.

True Christians WILL look like the Beatitudes. No, true Christians will receive mercy, will inherit the kingdom, will see God, WILL be saved because of the way they ARE.

6,038 posted on 06/02/2008 7:15:39 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: Forest Keeper; kosta50; aruanan; MarkBsnr; Dr. Eckleburg; irishtenor
What, the devil uses the idea that God is sovereign and ordains what He wants to happen in order to get souls over to satan's side? Hmmm. I'm not sure how much sense that makes

It's called the sin of PRESUMTION that leads one to believe that God ordains their sin and has secured heaven.

The cause of PRESUMPTION is pride that leads one to think God will not punish or exclude them from heaven.

This leads to man thinking he does not have to give up his sinful life and there is no need for mortification and penance

This is exactly what the devil wants you to think!

6,042 posted on 06/02/2008 9:23:49 AM PDT by stfassisi ( ("Above all gifts that Christ gives his beloved is that of overcoming self"-St Francis Assisi))
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