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To: kosta50; Kolokotronis; irishtenor; blue-duncan; Mad Dawg; HarleyD; stfassisi; Dr. Eckleburg; ...
FK: "So when Jesus immediately answered with this ...: Matt 16:17 : Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven.... you are saying that Jesus was lying, or that the Father lied in His revelation."

Absolutely not. Jesus confirmed that He is the (literal) Son of God even though the Jews (including +Peter) did not believe it. +Peter was saying that He is the moshiach (Jewish messiah), not that He is divine. No one believed that at that time. But Christ knew and He affirmed it.

But Jesus affirmed that what Peter said was from the Father. At best you are saying that Jesus misled them by not responding to what was said, as it was intended. And Jesus knew exactly what was going on of course. IOW, you are accusing Jesus of using some type of lawyer's trick. Wouldn't that be among the worst blasphemies? :) Plus, what possible purpose could it serve for Jesus to mislead so greatly TO His own disciples? Jesus said many things they didn't understand, but He never misled them. That would be Jesus imitating satan.

You have Jesus admitting that He is human but not divine. If Peter meant as you say, then Jesus steered him totally down the wrong path. Why would Jesus do this disservice? You are forced into saying that the Father also wished to mislead His disciples.

5,656 posted on 05/18/2008 11:11:09 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: Forest Keeper
“Jesus said many things they didn't understand, but He never misled them.”

That is true, obviously. In Matthew 16 itself, actually, our Lord told the disciples of His soon-to-come sufferings in Jerusalem, and Peter declared that it would never happen to Him (Matt. 16:21, 22). Peter even REBUKED the Lord for it!

And in subsequent announcements of the same, they did not understand and it is said even to be “hidden” from them (Luke 18:33, 34).

The Twelve did not understand the work of the Cross and Resurrection until AFTER the Resurrection.

If the Gospel we preach and by which we are saved now of necessity includes the Death, Burial, and Resurrection of Christ (1 Cor. 15:1-4), then the Gospel that the Twelve and the Seventy were commissioned to preach during Christ's earthly ministry (Matthew 10; Luke 9, 10) had to be a different message, because they did not understand the sufferings of Christ.

Further, Paul was given advanced revelation from the Head of the Church seated in the heavenly places after the Resurrection and detailed after Acts ch. 28, that Peter himself had a hard time understanding (see 2 Peter 3:15, 16).

5,659 posted on 05/19/2008 5:00:17 AM PDT by John Leland 1789
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To: Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; irishtenor; blue-duncan; Mad Dawg; HarleyD; stfassisi; ...
But Jesus affirmed that what Peter said was from the Father. At best you are saying that Jesus misled them by not responding to what was said, as it was intended

Jesus did not mislead anyone. The idea that the anointed one was divine was alien even to the Apostles. It is clear from the Gospels that they did not fully and consistently belive Him, and did not become full converts until after the Pentecost.

5,663 posted on 05/19/2008 6:13:16 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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