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To: Just mythoughts; kosta50; Kolokotronis; stfassisi; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg
Christ told Nidocemus that to see the Kingdom of God one must be born from above.... NOT the word that some scribe or translator place *again*. Meaning for a soul to be given opportunity of ever receiving 'grace' that soul must of their own free will come through woman into a flesh body.

Are you saying that we use our free will to decide to pass through the birth canal? Are you saying that the unborn in utero do not have flesh bodies?

5,418 posted on 05/08/2008 10:05:24 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: Forest Keeper
Are you saying that we use our free will to decide to pass through the birth canal? Are you saying that the unborn in utero do not have flesh bodies?

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the *children* are partakers of flesh and blood, He also Himself likewise took part of the same; That through death He might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil:

We are told what took place at the conception of Christ, His Soul/Spirit was placed in Mary, even recognized by John in uterus, as is the same with the conception of any child through man and woman. Our Father does not require of us to do anything that HE Himself was not willing to do as well. Big difference is that our Heavenly Father was, is, and will always be perfect, while not so of we children.

Even in the 'sour grapes' proverb of Ezekiel 18:4 Behold, all souls are Mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is Mine: the soul that sinneth it shall die.

This sure does not sound like a soul factory being described if the Heavenly Father is stating that all souls are His.

So yes each soul has the *free will* to be born of woman and pass through this flesh age. And NO the unborn are very much flesh bodies which is the vessel or body the soul inhabits as that is what gives that body life. (As described of Adam it was not until the breath of life = soul was breathed into his nostrils was Adam a living being.)

IICorinthians 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the LORD:

7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

5,423 posted on 05/09/2008 3:26:17 AM PDT by Just mythoughts (Isa.3:4 And I will give children to be their princes, and babes shall rule over them.)
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To: Forest Keeper; Just mythoughts; Kolokotronis; stfassisi; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg
FK to Just mythoughts: "Are you saying that we use our free will to decide to pass through the birth canal?"

Come on, FK, let's not be silly. :) Everything that has to do with us and God has to do with the "spirit," which has to do with how moral, virtuous, forgiving, merciful, etc. we are. Our bilogical functions (unless we willingly allow them to counter those moral qualities mentioned above) are irrelevant.

You are born because the laws of nature (which we believe God instituted) expell the product. It happens in all mammals after a genstational period specific to each species, not just to humans.

We are born because men and women get together for various reasons and engage in reporudctive activities. Here, again, the intent can be either a blesisng or damnation (leaving it up to us), and the product that results can be the product of love or the product of lust; it can cherrished or it can be rejected; it can be cared for or dumped.

Even natural laws get involved here: spontaneous abortions (because of erroneous genetic conjunction during fertilization result in nonviavble product), as many as one in five prgnancies.

But most of what happens to us is our doing.

5,424 posted on 05/09/2008 5:56:36 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodox is pure Christianity)
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