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To: kosta50; blue-duncan
FK: "We are tested for OUR benefit. Have you ever been through a trial and come out better spiritually?"

Maybe some desire to be tested; others are happy the way they are. You keep telling me how secure you are in your belief. Do you need to go through a Job-like trial to feel "better" about it?

Well, I don't pray a lot for terrible things to happen to me, if that's what you mean. :) And as for what I need, I have turned ALL of that over to God alone. I am not mine to make those decisions. I am God's for Him to make them.

3,699 posted on 03/08/2008 8:47:06 PM PST by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: Forest Keeper; blue-duncan
Well, I don't pray a lot for terrible things to happen to me, if that's what you mean

You didn't answer my question, counselor. You deflected it to put it mildly. You and others on your side keep telling me that God tests people, not for His but for their benefit.

I asked you specifically and others in general: if you are 100% secure in your salvation (and therefore faith) why would you benefit by being tested like Job was (and he was 'blameless')?

If God tests blameless people, what benefit do they get unless it is indented to strengthen their faith? In which case you are not secure in your faith and salvation as you say you are.

Again, there was no point in testing Jesus, unless there was some 'benefit' that He would 'gain' from it as far as His faith is concerned, since there was no chance that He would fail.

But it makes perfect sense if Jesus is seen by the early Apostles to be the Jewish messiah, a mortal human, beloved of God, a favorite of God, the "son of God," like the angels and kings, a man who would be king of kings (on earth), blameless and perfect (like Job)!

And it would make perfect sense that He would be led into the Desert by the Power (Spirit) of God, as the bible teaches (God doesn't need to be led by His own Spirit!). All this points strongly to Jesus being considered a special, if not perfect human, an ideal man (which he is!), but not God!

Clearly, the Apostles recognized His divinity at a later date and realized that the words they used (e.g. "son of God") which they understood in the Old Testament manner, were words with a new meaning.

3,717 posted on 03/09/2008 8:56:07 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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