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God's gift to us: Radical Freedom (Process Theology and the existence of natural evils)
ModernConservative.com ^ | Christopher Cook

Posted on 12/10/2007 5:20:09 AM PST by connell

By Christopher Cook

Last night, my wife showed me an article about a young girl with an inoperable brain tumor, a little girl who has been given three months to live. The question in the air was why couldn't that Omaha mall murderer have gotten a brain tumor instead of this little girl?

A couple of years back, a dear old friend (and former man of the cloth) and I had discussions along this general line. He introduced me to the concept of process theology, and we talked about the following question:

How could an omni-benevolent God allow rocks to fall on good people's heads while they're hiking...or allow tumors to grow in the bodies of innocent children? How could He, being totally Good, allow such things?

When these questions come up in regards to God allowing human evil, the explanation is usually—and I would argue, correctly—that God, having made us with freewill, cannot or does not prevent human evil because that would take away our freewill. And of course, our freewill is a necessary component of who we are. Take it away, and we are robots, and not the creations God wished us to be: free to love Him, free to reject Him, and free in every other way.

The question becomes thornier, however, when discussing the evils that can be visited upon us by the natural world. The suggestion made by my priest friend in those conversations was that God may actually be incapable...

(Excerpt) Read more at modernconservative.com ...


TOPICS: General Discusssion; Theology
KEYWORDS: evil; freedom; freewill; processtheology

1 posted on 12/10/2007 5:20:13 AM PST by connell
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To: connell; Alex Murphy; irishtenor; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg
that God, having made us with freewill, cannot or does not prevent human evil because that would take away our freewill. And of course, our freewill is a necessary component of who we are. Take it away, and we are robots, and not the creations God wished us to be: free to love Him, free to reject Him, and free in every other way.

You forgot the barf alert.

2 posted on 12/10/2007 6:46:49 AM PST by Gamecock (There was only one victorious life.)
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and free in every other way.

Except our bondage to sin.

3 posted on 12/10/2007 6:47:30 AM PST by Gamecock (There was only one victorious life.)
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To: Gamecock; connell; irishtenor; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg
HEROD COULDN'T KILL HIM...but freewill can stop Him dead in His tracks!

Drop a quarter in Alex's jukebox, for this golden oldie from 2004...

GREG BOYD IS BACK IN TOWN
sung to the tune of "The Boys Are Back In Town",
as recorded by the band Thin Lizzy

Guess what just came back today?
A heresy that had been away
Hasn't changed, hasn't much to say
And Man? You're back and in charge today

God was asking if you were around
He didn't know you were living downtown
He cannot tell just if you're lost or found
It drives the Old Man crazy

Greg Boyd is back in town

The future ain't what it was supposed to be
Every night God wonders what will happen after 3:00
You make choices that God can never see
Not before you make them

One night over at the Baker place
Well the editor upped and he slapped Jesus’ face
God's Sovereignty, it stops at your chin
If God can’t really know, can He know anything?

Sunday night you’ll be dressed to kill
At the Woodland Hills Church you will
The wine will flow, but no blood will spill
Until you want it to, then you'll think about it

The preacher in the pulpit, getting lots of verses wrong
Hell must be getting warmer, it won’t be long
It won’t be long till the book tour comes
Now that Greg Boyd is here again

Greg Boyd is back in town

The above song lyrics are in no way meant to ridicule, or otherwise malign, the posters on Free Republic (including those who might publicly and openly support the heresy of "Open Theism" as it is defined by Historic Christianity [and even by other books printed by the publishing company Baker Book House]), those who have difficulty reading tiny legal print, or the former members of the 80s rock group Thin Lizzy. Do not attempt to drive while reading this post. Do not mix with alcohol or prescription medications. Do not drink while reading this post, unless you enjoy milk coming out of your nostrils. Avoid rubbing Flaming Hot Cheetos directly into the eyes. Warning - your computer monitor is fatal if swallowed.

4 posted on 12/10/2007 6:52:37 AM PST by Alex Murphy ("Therefore the prudent keep silent at that time, for it is an evil time." - Amos 5:13)
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To: connell
Why not simply acknowledge and trust G-d's all-embracing Providence and stop obsessing about "the problem of evil?"

Evil is not a problem for believers in G-d. It is a problem for deniers. In the absence of an Omnipotent Creator to proclaim what is good and what is evil objective evil cannot exist.

Why do people who claim the universe is random and meaningless continually crusade for the eradication of "evils" that by definition cannot exist in a random, meaningless universe???

5 posted on 12/10/2007 7:55:29 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator ( . . . Vayo'mer "'Ani Yosef 'achiykhem 'asher-mekhartem 'oti Mitzraymah.")
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To: connell
It appears that God wished for us to be totally, radically free. And it seems to me that we would not have that radical freedom if we lived in a universe that was regularly micromanaged to prevent all bad things that might result from living in a universe subject to the random whims of natural law.

So this means when the Cosmos is finally renewed and redeemed in totality, total freedom will not exist?

Rather, I think it's in the present time that total freedom does not exist. Death is the enemy of freedom, and sin is death.

The death of sinners is a mercy, insofar as death keeps them from worsening their sins. The death of saints is a blessing for them, for it calls them home to God.

6 posted on 12/10/2007 12:31:32 PM PST by Dumb_Ox (http://kevinjjones.blogspot.com)
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To: connell
Process theology is unbiblical.

Given process theology, how would one explain the story of Job?

Fallen, finite man invented process theology because he thinks that he is obviously fairer, smarter and more just than Sovereign God.

7 posted on 12/10/2007 2:18:33 PM PST by pby
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To: pby
I'm with you. You bring up Job; I once brought up Noah to make the same general point. The response, of course, was that the Noah story was "only allegorical."

The only thing I know for sure about why God does what He does is that I am too limited, at least in my current state, to comprehend the incredible bigness of God's plan.
8 posted on 12/10/2007 4:23:24 PM PST by connell (I will not cease from mental fight, nor shall my sword sleep in my hand)
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To: connell; Gamecock; Alex Murphy; irishtenor; Dr. Eckleburg
How could an omni-benevolent God allow rocks to fall on good people's heads while they're hiking...or allow tumors to grow in the bodies of innocent children? How could He, being totally Good, allow such things?

The problem with this theory is that it assumes there are some people who are better than others. Here is an interesting passage in Job:

The interesting point of this passage is that our sin doesn't hurt God or affect Him in any way. Neither does our "righteousness". God is neither impressed with our wickedness or our righteousness. Yet so many people think that we can work our way into God's favor by being "good"-however they want to define it. What hogwash. Anything that we do is as filthy rags to Him. Only what Christ has done counts for anything.

This author mistakenly assumes the Omaha mall murderer was worse than the little girl with the brain tumor (a point he never answered). Actually to God they are both exactly the same. God shows no partiality.

This author has a totally wrong perspective on soteriology and God's saving grace. Is it any wonder he refers to the Pope rather than the scriptures?

The Myth of Free Will

9 posted on 12/10/2007 5:20:01 PM PST by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD

That is what they have so much trouble undestanding. We are vessels made of clay, and the Potter uses us as he wishes. None of us are of any value until the Potter decides to use us. How he uses us is up to him, also. It is not up to the pot to tell the Potter what to do.


10 posted on 12/10/2007 5:45:48 PM PST by irishtenor (History was written before God said "Let there be light.")
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