[jwalsh07]

See rule one, that being that salvation is through God's grace period.

Rule two is "that Catholics believe that grace can not be had without faith in Jesus Christ...", ackonowledging that Catholics already know Christ and to know Christ and not have faith in Him is something different from not knowing of Christ at all.

Think of it as a nested hierarchy. :-}

[Iscool]

Rule two is "that Catholics believe that grace can not be had without faith in Jesus Christ...", ackonowledging that Catholics already know Christ and to know Christ and not have faith in Him is something different from not knowing of Christ at all.

I've seen on countless threads that babies receive this 'grace' at baptism...They certainly do not have faith in Jesus Christ...