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To: Grudgebringer; Dr. Eckleburg
Why do you limit Christ? Can He not share His Glory with others? I believe He is powerful enough to just do that.

Only if He can lie? Can God lie?

Isaiah 42:8 I am Jehovah, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images.

Isaiah 48:11 For My own sake, for My own sake, I will do it; For how should My name be profaned? And I will not give My glory to another.

Just as Samson was granted great strength. Or when God worked through Moses to part the Red Sea. Or as Jesus gave the apostles the power to forgive sin. God holds Mary in a special place prepared for her in His Kingdom.

Do you have Statues of Samson or Moses in your church? No where does it say in scripture PROPERLY READ that Mary has a SPECIAL PLACE in fact scripture indicates that Christ holds all the elect in the SAME affection in which he holds his mother

Mat 12:48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?

Mat 12:49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!

Mat 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

So I, and ever one of the elect ,are as loved of Christ as Mary

Here’s a new one for you. Did you know John the Baptist never committed a sin in his entire life?

Ahh another doctrine of man?

Your church does not agree with you.

578 Jesus, Israel's Messiah and therefore the greatest in the kingdom of heaven, was to fulfill the Lawby keeping it in its all embracing detail - according to his own words, down to "the least of these commandments".330 He is in fact the only one who could keep it perfectly.331 On their own admission the Jews were never able to observe the Law in its entirety without violating the least of its precepts.332 This is why every year on the Day of Atonement the children of Israel ask God's forgiveness for their transgressions of the Law. The Law indeed makes up one inseparable whole, and St. James recalls, "Whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.

So again , the ONLY one that COULD KEEP THE LAW PERFECTLY ( never sin) was God HIMSELF as Christ.

John was prophesied in the OT, He was a holy man that Christ recognized as the greatest man born of woman.. BUT no where does scripture say he never sinned..

774 posted on 10/27/2007 9:23:54 PM PDT by ears_to_hear (1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:......)
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To: ears_to_hear

Isaiah 42:8 I am Jehovah, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images.

Isaiah 48:11 For My own sake, for My own sake, I will do it; For how should My name be profaned? And I will not give My glory to another.

= = = =

INDEED!

ITTM

INDEED TO THE MAX


783 posted on 10/27/2007 9:55:08 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: ears_to_hear; Dr. Eckleburg

Having Statues is not idolatry. http://www.davidmacd.com/catholic/statues_in_church.htm.

I would tell you here is an example of Idolatry. As a Christian working for an organization such as Planned Parenthood for money. Abortion goes against God yet that person works there for money. Seek God first. If that person understood this they would realize they are seeking money (idol that is worshiped today)and not seeking God first. Or a lawyer that is screwing people for money he is committing idolatry. The Golden Calf was a symbol of Idolatry. There are many other forms. Sex can be one as well.

I find it amazing that you a lay person argue with a set of church beliefs that have been held for over 2000 years. You haven’t even address the words of Martin Luther about Mary. Even he was devoted to Mary. You seem to ignore this. Before the reformation in 1500s there were no protestants. EVERYONE was Catholic. There were no books and not many could read so everyone went to church to read the Bible.

The Catholic Church put together the Bible in the first place. Why would they put together the something that disputes their beliefs. When you read the Bible you can’t just read it in plain English. You have to understand the times, the Kingdom of Juda and the way things were explained.

For example does “I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Matthew 19:24.” Is the eye of the needle a physical needle or perhaps Jesus was referring to a certain gate in Jerusalem called Needle’s Eye, that doorway was built like the eye of a needle and so low that a camel could only pass if it entered kneeling and unencumbered with baggage.

The ‘Bible Alone’ wasn’t even until that time of reformations. But guess what? Still no one had their own Bibles. Books were for rich people. A lot couldn’t read. They still had to go to Church to have it interpreted for them.

29Then the Spirit said to Philip, “Go over to this chariot and join it.” 30So Philip ran up to it and heard him reading the prophet Isaiah. He asked, “Do you understand what you are reading?” 31He replied, “How can I, unless someone guides me?” And he invited Philip to get in and sit beside him. Acts 29-31.

Did you know Luther wanted to throw out the Apocalypse? If he did you protestants would have nothing to talk about. As for protestant beliefs The Rapture belief started lass than 150 years ago. Where is that in the bible?

As for John the Baptist

‘I tell you, among those born of women none is greater than John; yet he who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.’ “ (Lk 7:28).

John only had original sin. Only Jesus the people in Heaven, and Mary were greater than he.

The phrase “born of woman” means born with original sin otherwise Jesus would fall into that category because He has a human Mother.

How was John the Baptist able to avoid all sin? Sacred Scripture tells us the words of the angel who spoke to Zechariah about his future son (John the Baptist). “ ‘…he will be great before the Lord…and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit, even from his mother’s womb.” (Lk 1:15). John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit even before he was born, when he was a child in his mother Elizabeth’s womb.

When was John the Baptist filled with the Holy Spirit? Sacred Scripture describes the visit of the Virgin Mary to Elizabeth. “And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit….” (Lk 1:41). When Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit, so too was the child within her womb filled with the Holy Spirit. At that time, the child Jesus was in the womb of the Virgin Mary, and John the Baptist was in the womb of Elizabeth. Thus, it was through Jesus, present in the Virgin Mary’s womb, that the Holy Spirit was sent upon Elizabeth and upon John the Baptist.

Go read about the First Fruits. The Bible clearly states these first Christians were free on sin.

Then I looked, and lo, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven like the sound of many waters and like the sound of loud thunder; the voice I heard was like the sound of harpers playing on their harps, and they sing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who had been redeemed from the earth. It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are chaste; it is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes; these have been redeemed from mankind as first fruits for God and the Lamb, and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are spotless.” (Rev 14:1-5).


791 posted on 10/28/2007 7:00:21 AM PDT by Grudgebringer
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