Posted on 10/25/2007 9:24:05 AM PDT by NYer
The Other Christ: Padre Pio and 19th Century Italy, by the historian Sergio Luzzatto, draws on a document found in the Vatican's archive.
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The document reveals the testimony of a pharmacist who said that the young Padre Pio bought four grams of carbolic acid in 1919.
"I was an admirer of Padre Pio and I met him for the first time on 31 July 1919," wrote Maria De Vito.
She claimed to have spent a month with the priest in the southern town of San Giovanni Rotondo, seeing him often.
"Padre Pio called me to him in complete secrecy and telling me not to tell his fellow brothers, he gave me personally an empty bottle, and asked if I would act as a chauffeur to transport it back from Foggia to San Giovanni Rotondo with four grams of pure carbolic acid.
"He explained that the acid was for disinfecting syringes for injections. He also asked for other things, such as Valda pastilles."
The testimony was originally presented to the Vatican by the Archbishop of Manfredonia, Pasquale Gagliardi, as proof that Padre Pio caused his own stigmata with acid.
It was examined by the Holy See during the beatification process of Padre Pio and apparently dismissed.
Padre Pio, whose real name was Francesco Forgione, died in 1968. He was made a saint in 2002. A recent survey in Italy showed that more people prayed to him than to Jesus or the Virgin Mary. He exhibited stigmata throughout his life, starting in 1911.
The new allegations were greeted with an instant dismissal from his supporters. The Catholic Anti-Defamation League said Mr Luzzatto was a liar and was "spreading anti-Catholic libels".
Pietro Siffi, the president of the League, said: "We would like to remind Mr Luzzatto that according to Catholic doctrine, canonisation carries with it papal infallibility.
"We would like to suggest to Mr Luzzatto that he dedicates his energies to studying religion properly."
LOL NAsbU Ezekiel 36:26 "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and
put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your
flesh and give you a heart of flesh.
Thanks, Campion
Campion, you’re a champion. :-)
BTW—if in a short while, you see that my account is no longer there, it isn’t because I was banned or suspended. :-)
It’s just that I left.
Jesus fulfilled the law ...
Please refer to post #745 by Grudgebringer—that is where the phrase ‘stay His fury’ came from, okay? That’s who I was questioning.
You are the Man.
Grudgebringer, can you help me with the "Stay His Fury," line? What's up with that? Reference to Esther or what?
Let me rephrase that ....
I was gonna say! [see my picture on my FReeper page, LOL!]
:-)
... and? That mean we think sex is evil, because we do the Churching of women?
And I'm noting a certain silence about Paul and the ministry of men here. What is the deal? You make a claim about Paul in attempted refutation of a point and I go to the text and find women and virgins being advised to stay single, and so we just kind of gloss over that?
Remember the thesis is that the advocacy of celibacy or virginity demonstrates conclusively that RCs think sex is evil or sinful. So I adduce the words of our Lord and of Paul the Apostle. Your the guys all over us for not finding stuff in Scripture, but when we do it just goes into the memory hole, and we move on to the Churching of wimmins?
ANd do we know what the rite is? I don't know how authoritative this site is, but here's what it says:
Churching is the woman's way of giving thanksgiving to God for the birth of her child, and predisposes her, through the priestly blessing that is a part of the ritual, to receive the graces necessary to raise her child in a manner pleasing to God.So the new covenant means we should stay away from giving thanks? What's so old covenant about giving thanks? fren't we told to give thanks all the time? What's so anti-sex about this rite?Know that Churching is not a "purification" ceremony, though it is imitative of the day, which we commemorate on 2 February (Candlemas), that Mary underwent her "purification" (ceremonially speaking and in obedience to the Old Law) and presented her Son in the Temple to Simeon.
UM, hubba hubba ... AND what a cutie that kid is!
I find little girls “get” the whole camera thing pretty early on. Mine started telling me how to take her photo and stuff. (She’s almost 24 now, but I remember ...) I got to be the primary care giver, and while it kind of trashed my plans for world domination, I got the better end of the deal.
Exactly, LOL! :-)
We have to tell her sometimes NOT to smile a ‘cheesy’ smile when we are looking for more natural poses. :-)
In 1501 at the age of eighteen Luther entered the University of Erfurt where he studied the liberal arts, and in 1505 attained his Master’s degree with the intention of studying Law as was his father’s wish. However that was not to be as it is said that while Luther was just outside of Stotterheim one day after visiting his parents he was caught in a terrific thunderstorm where lightning struck nearby, thus throwing him to the ground and in his terror he called out “St. Anne Help me! I will become a monk!”
Sounds like your leader praying to a Saint to me.
1. Luther is not my leader.
I respect a lot of the good he did for the Christian Church universal. He was flawed as well as the RC edifice of the time was exceedingly flawed.
2. I have no responsibility for his conditioning toward praying to anyone else but God. He has since learned the folly of that, I’m sure.
And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.
Ne·hush·tan n. [Heb.]
A thing of brass; — the name under which the Israelites worshiped the brazen serpent made by Moses.
Worshiped the brazen serpent, idolatry?
But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. [John 21:25; RSV]
Sola Scriptura was started in the 1500s.
You want quotes I can play that game too.
“I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you.”
1 Corinthians 11:2
So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us (Apostles), either by word of mouth (oral) or by letter (Epistle). [2 Thess. 2:15]
...Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, speaking of this as he does in all his letters. There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. [2 Peter 3:15-16]
First of all you must understand this, that no prophesy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God. [2 Peter 1:20-21]
Besides you protestants can’t even agree on the Bible. You protestants have different sects just as the different types of Jews in Biblical times. Different protestant denominations have completely different beliefs from each other. For example over Baptism, some Protestants accept the validity of infant Baptism, while others do not. Some believe in the necessity of Baptism for salvation, citing Mark 16:16, while others disagree by citing John 3:16. They all claim to be Bible-based, but still they disagree over fundamental issues regarding salvation. Plus you are trying to use a Catholic book to decide! You guys can’t even tell which books belong in the Bible because you have no way of knowing unless you admit the Catholic Church put the Bible together which we know is a fact in 397 AD.
The Catholics have had the same beliefs for 2000 years and thats why the Catholic Church will last forever. Everything I believe is because the Church told me so. The Catholic Church has that authority.
What is the pillar and bulwark of truth? The Bible? Nope. The Catholic Church.
..the household of God, which is the Church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth. [1 Tim. 3:15]
But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. [John 21:25; RSV]
But these things are not for us to know huh?
NAsbU Acts 17:11 Now these (Bereans) were more noble-minded
shalom b'shem Yah'shua
than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great
eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so.
Amen.
...Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, speaking of this as he does in all his letters. There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. [2 Peter 3:15-16]
If Bible alone is the way to go, then what did the Christians do for 400 years before there was a Bible. There were tons of writings called scripture. Many more books than there are in the Bible.
Which is what the Bereans were searching to see if Rav Sha'ul was telling the truth. You seem to dismiss the Tanach.
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