Posted on 10/20/2007 5:23:07 AM PDT by Santiago de la Vega
One of our colleagues here on FR has asked for an explanation of my comments about sexual preferences.
Here's what I said.
In the last two thousand years, the most important advance in moral and ethical practice and teaching is forgiveness. Christ embodied that virtue and risked - and lost - his life for it.
No other single characteristic has so greatly transformed religion and society. It's the force that says to a criminal: "repent, make amends, and you can return to society."
Forgiveness, even more importantly, liberates those who have been trespassed against, allowing them to move past the offense and continue their lives in peace.
A vengeful world cannot move past the offense and wastes its time in endless feuding and fighting.
With the advent of Christ's teaching we get a new world, one of forgiveness instead of a vengeful one.
It's inconceivable that Christ would not understand that homosexuality is not a choice, but a desire driven by innate passions.
And even if it was not, he would still forgive them.
your assumption is based on a false premise.
behavior is a choice.
There is ZERO science to support the “gene” theory.
NONE. The only so called claims are created with flawed or outright fabricated “agenda” scientists.
I think a more appropriate example would be Christs reaction to the money changers. Perhaps the prostitute (another recreational sex sinner) who was told go forth and sin no more.
You premise is just based on a false asumption.
Sin involves action. When Christ told sinners, “Go and sin no more,” He meant for them to change their actions.
That He would have forgiven unrepented sin is completely outside of His own teachings.
So's alcoholism. That's OK, too?
And even if it was not, he would still forgive them.
Without repentance? I think you argue yourself that he would not.
And for heterosexual men, it is an "innate passion" to screw any female that crosses their path, yet we are expected not to do so, and remain faithful to our spouse, and celibate if not married.
Sure, Christ would forgive a repentant queer, who was trying not to yield to those "innate passions", but as for the militant ones with no such intention---not likely.
Forgiveness is powerful.
We should forgive the poster here.
Something is important to you, hope it agrees with God.
Santiago, you may be a captain of economic industry but as far as “sin” and “forgiveness” you know little.
What part of “go and sin no more” do you not understand?
Let me guess, I believe it is the “sin no more” part.
“you are forgiven, “go and sin no more”!!!!!!!!!!!!.
I think this kills your whole theory!!!
You forget that, God is a vengeful God and, he hates sin, OF ANY KIND.
A few thoughts:
As John prepared the way in the wilderness for his cousin, so repentance prepares the heart to receive forgiveness.
Repentance means this - stop, turn, and follow God.
The only unrepentant sinner I know of that Jesus “forgave” was his unknowing killers - not sure who exactly He was referring to, since, surely, some knew exactly who He was. And interestingly enough - Jesus did not say “I forgive you,” but asked His father to.
If your brother has something against you, it is incumbent upon you to go to him and be reconciled.
Jesus said that if your brother comes to you seven times in a day and repents, you must forgive him seven times. Wasn’t all that talk about repentance a waste of time if you were required to forgive even if your brother doesn’t repent?
Jesus said that we are to forgive as our Father in Heaven forgives. Last time I checked, God makes forgiveness available, but the unrepentant are unforgiven.
The parables Jesus tells about forgiveness turn on the unforgiveness of the forgiven being emblematic of their lack of repentance. Indeed, the unmerciful servant was punished after supposedly receiving forgiveness.
Joseph is an often forgotten example of a forgiver. When he forgave his brothers, he sent everyone else out of the room, then told his brothers how their sin against him was part of God’s plan. Most people I know who give examples about how they have been liberated by forgiveness (probably an oxymoron) don’t include this element.
God forgets the sin of those He forgives. Do you? Most Christians’ attitudes seem to be “I’ve forgiven you, now I am done with you.”
If a man forgives his wife for her adultery, why is there divorce?
What does forgiveness look like to you?
Homosexuality is a choice and a desire.
Homosexuals choose to respond to the innate desire within themselves.
Similarly a heterosexual chooses to respond to innate desires when he commits lust or adultery.
It’s inconceivable that Christ would not understand that homosexuality is not a choice, but a desire driven by innate passions.
And even if it was not, he would still forgive them.
Everything we do involves choice on our part...EVERYTHING!
He would forgive them if they ASKED Him to AND if they OTHERWISE REPENTED. It is inconceivable that you don’t understand something so simple.
Christ "risked" nothing. He "lost" nothing.
What He did was give Himself for us, so that that we may not take the punishment our sins have earned for us.
What happens in Vega really should stay in Vega.
Sin is the choice you make before any action is taken. The action is merely the symptom of the sin.
My belief is that there is only one sin--and everyone is guilty of it. That sin is pride. Once you decide that you know better about your life, or should be the one who decides what you "deserve" or require, then you have committed the sin of pride. After that, it's all downhill. The symptom doesn't matter. How the pride expresses itself doesn't matter.
Re-read the 10 commandments with the above idea in mind, and see what conclusions you come to. Everything there is based on pride.
The reason there is a divorce is that the wife OR husband can no longer be trusted to “sin no more”
Generally in real world divorces, forgivness happend a “few times” before the divorce. God, as they say, does not live in a vacume.
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