Posted on 09/28/2007 6:20:54 AM PDT by Ottofire
Peter = G4074 Πέτρος Petros pet'-ros Apparently a primary word; a (piece of) rock (larger than G3037); as a name, Petrus, an apostle: - Peter, rock. Compare G2786.
Rock [as used in Matt 16:18] = G4073 πέτρα petra pet'-ra Feminine of the same as G4074; a (mass of) rock (literally or figuratively): - rock.
Petros = a piece of THE ROCK.
Petra = THE ROCK
Mat 16:15 He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" Mat 16:16 Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." Mat 16:17 And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. Mat 16:18 "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. Mat 16:19 "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."
The Rock [the Foundation] of the Church of Christ is "that He is the The Christ, The Son of The Living God." And that is what He Jesus built His church on, that truth, that revelation, not a man...not any man. Note Jesus said that was revealed to Peter [Simon]. And the gates of hades have not overpowered it. They have overpowered the Roman Catholic Church. Right? The RCC has failed in the face of evil time after time. Murder, mass murder, torture, greed, perversion, lust for wealth and power....etc
And Jesus gave His People the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever they bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever they loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven." The proof that this is true is His people are still binding [forbidding] and loosing [permitting] by His authority in a spiritual sense, while the RCC is not. There is no power of God being demonstrated by the RCC because it does not have the authority to do so. That is why they are so attracted to strange superstitious things like this statue is crying or that loaf of bread looks like Jesus. Understand their are still people being raised from the dead and miraculously healed and demons being cast out today by those that belong to Jesus.
A question to ponder. If Peter was the head of the church instead of Jesus, why was this not passed onto another man when Peter died? There was plenty of New Testament written after, yet they never bothered to record who was now the new head of the church. 300 hundred years later we have the start of this catholic religion and the beginning of popes.
oohhh ... and just when I was beginning to get my hyperbole working.
I much agree about Prottys falling for the same hellish strategies re connecting church and state at the highest earthly levels.
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. - Luke 14:26
Commentary D-R... “Hate not”... The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ.
I would add church & even Mary, if they are a distraction or attempt to put a yoke on me.
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INDEED.
May not get to post as much as I’d prefer to this thread for some hours but should return within 24-72.
When your contrivance and artifice brings me grace, I’ll be in touch.
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Hmmmm . . . I’m at a loss. What RC edifice parochial school teaches that
HISTORICAL FACTS = “contrivance?”
Hmmmm
Reads like a wholesale denial of the historical facts presented in the opening article of this thread.
And the commentary presented by the early church fathers.
Not surprising . . . but disappointing.
Let me get this straight . . .
The RC edifice is building virtually all of it’s vast fossilized structure on
God’s often evident preference for puns???
LOL
ROTFLOL
GTTM
HOHOHOHOHOHO HAWHAWHAWHAW!
That’s tooooo much. Thanks for that insight. I hadn’t realized that before. What a revelation!
What a riot. Pathetic but a riot nevertheless.
I'm sure you know, we don't do the authority gig, but be my guest.
Oh, Dear! Now, Silverlings,
There you go again with the truth. But you need to know, it's heresy to the RC edifice.
They just can't bear the thought that St Pete doesn't go home with all the marbles or foundation stones or tacos or whatever. It might tweak his impetuous personality and then where would they be?
And they REALLY don't want to face the truth so squarely that they have to begin anew constructing a whole NEW edifice of shakey cards. Oh Dear!
what it looks like
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NOT AT ALL.
It takes very, very, VERY distorted glasses from hell to mangle the historical facts even of the early RC edifice toward such nonsense.
Certainly the consensus of the authentic early church was no where near such a horrific heresy.
Catholic Catechism
424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: ‘You are the Christ, the Son of the living God. On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.
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Oh, dear. More truth from their own documents!
The truth rolls on.
Thx.
I'm sure it does.
Every time a faction doesn't like what those they nominally hold as "authorities" tell them, off they go to start another denomination. Hardly the picture of Christian unity found ANYWHERE in the New Testament.
Pay better attention to the New Testament & early Church history. There have been spin offs from the Church since it's inception. The Catholic Church calls them heretics, tho some of the spin offs were created mostly because of politics, not religious beliefs.
When the Catholic Church does it, it's for the good of the Church, but when it happens with a Protestant church it's proof that the Protestant model is flawed.
I think Catholic Church discipline is at an all time low & in some areas, the wolves are flourishing, just as they are within some Protestant sects.
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True.
Was it John-Mark who Paul dumped from his travels? But not from the Faith!
The RC edifice characters have about convinced me of something I hadn't thought of before . . .
I wonder . . . could it be that God allowed--maybe even facilitated such splits often enough
JUST TO AVOID AN ENORMOUS insensitive OVERWEENING POLITICAL BUREAUCRACY akin to the monopolistic arrogant pharisees of Jesus' earthly days?
And it is quite an enormous joke . . . several jokes, actually . . .
1. That the early fathers engaged in unanimous consent IN SUPPORT of the then NONEXISTENT RC edifice--WHEN IN FACT, THEY WERE SET AGAINST IT in terms of Sola Scriptura AS WELL AS assigning any special anything to any particular Bishop in any particular location. The initial doc of this thread documents that quite clearly. Noise to the contrary is DENYING TRUTH AND HISTORY.
2. That the "EXCLUSIVELY RC" edifice [WHEN THERE WAS NONE SUCH] and it's magicsterical [WHEN THERE WAS NONE SUCH] have had 2,000 years of seamless; homogeneous; unchanging set of doctrine and dogma--WHEN THEY HAVE NOT. Yet they expect us to respect them as the sole repository of all spiritual truth!!!!!!!!!! WHAT OUTRAGEOUS FALSEHOOD! WHAT OUTRAGEOUS ARROGANCE!!!! What an affront to God, authentic Christians and our intelligence! I guess it evolved from centuries of the political theological elite treating the serfs like dumb ignorant serfs.
3. In addition to the DECEPTIONS, LIES--ACTUALLY--about Christ's anointing Peter as head of all Christendom--PRETENDING--INSISTING that the first 400 or so years of Christianity homogeneously affirmed that by unanimous consent WHEN THEY DEFINITELY AND POINTEDLY DID NOT!
3. in addition to the brazen DECEPTION about Peter, they would have us believe that there was a homogeneous unanimous consent about all the extra supernatural hogwash about Mary quite contrary to Scripture, TOO!--and that THAT TOO was supported by all authentic Christianity the first 400 years of the church when it DEFINITELY WAS
Yet they brazenly expect us to respect them as the sole repository of spiritual truth. They must really take us for IQ 20 idiots. Or perhaps they think we cannot have access nor reading and critical thinking skills to deal with the authentic docs of the early church still available.
The edifice must really long for the days when dissenters were burned at the stake and shredded on the rack. Monopolies--especially political, RELIGIOUS monopolies tend to become that way. That human nature thing, again.
I sort of have a few shreds of compassion for such hidiocies . . . if they didn't continue to propagandize with such falsehoods, the bulk of the house of cards would come tumbling down. Kind of reminds me of the High Priest saying that Jesus should die better than have the Nation of Israel troubled more 2,000 years ago.
Welllllllllll, I'm 100% convinced God has a different perspective in our era. I believe He's gearing up to clean house. And the House Cleaning will pay little to no attention to denominational, organizational boundaries. Congregations and families where GOD IS LOVED, PUT FIRST AUTHENTICALLY FROM THE HEART IN SPIRIT AND TRUTH ACCORDING TO THE BIBLICAL AND HOLY SPIRIT'S PRIORITIES--WILL BE BLESSED.
Those failing on those scores will be severely disciplined at best. Perhaps most will be shredded, obliterated, fini--cease to exist. It won't matter their age nor their size. It won't matter how lofty their fou
Jesus Christ's message was elegant & simple. There are times when it's difficult to see the elegant beauty of the fir tree, as the ornaments, tinsel & lights that have been hung on it tend to draw one's eyes.
JUST TO AVOID AN ENORMOUS insensitive OVERWEENING POLITICAL BUREAUCRACY akin to the monopolistic arrogant pharisees of Jesus' earthly days?
If I agree, someone's gonna call down "Irving's Law" on the both of us. LOL
Have forgotten Irving’s law????!
Jesus Christ’s message was elegant & simple. There are times when it’s difficult to see the elegant beauty of the fir tree, as the ornaments, tinsel & lights that have been hung on it tend to draw one’s eyes.
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Agreed.
Thanks for the link.
And . . . like most generalizations . . . they are . . . generally . . . limited.
I happen to be a Catholic and for two reasons. First, I admit I was born into a religious Catholic family; and second, I actually search out the true Catholic position whenever a controversy arises about scripture or dogma or papal statements. Most often the news media gives out false information about anything Catholic. And, the folks who do not like the Catholic church are quick to believe them.
That being said, I have to admire the zeal of evangelical Christians. Thank God for their love of Christ and their willingness to be public about the wonderful God we have who sent His Only Begotten Son into th world to teach us and to die for us on a cross. I just wish the Catholic Church had more leaders with such enthusiasm. Thank God for EWTN.
I also wish the evangelicals would get their act together when it comes to the history of the Catholic Church and Western civilization. The writer above is typical of a man who was probably poorly catechized by his instructors, and he thus never did have a clear understanding of the deep bonding that comes with the recognition of Jesus as a personal savior. So, I feel sorry for him. I can only be happy however that he has found a bond with Jesus now, even though he is outside the sacraments of the Catholic Church. He would better serve the Lord if he came back into the church with his new found zeal and tried to help the church that Jesus founded 2000 years ago.
Religious dogma coming out of Holy Scriptures and the witness of the apostles to the first century church leaders has been erroneously intertwined with admitted errors made by sinful mankind over the course of 2000 years. Just because someone in the church made political errors, committed sins, etc. over 2 millenia, does not negate the truths of the Christian faith as handed down by the apostles. That faith is the faith of the Catholic Church. In the end truth is truth. Of course, back to the beginning - this is my opinion.
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