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The Sign of the Cross
Catholic Education Resource Center CERC ^ | 2003 | FR. WILLIAM SAUNDERS

Posted on 08/10/2007 9:39:37 PM PDT by Salvation

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To: doc1019

It sounds like Tertulian was doing it (250 AD) even as the Church was still putting the Bible together in its final form.


21 posted on 08/11/2007 6:37:36 PM PDT by bboop (Stealth Tutor)
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To: Iscool

I thought there were crosses in Protestant churches.


22 posted on 08/12/2007 10:05:04 AM PDT by D-fendr
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To: D-fendr
I thought there were crosses in Protestant churches.

Some...Not all...

23 posted on 08/12/2007 3:45:41 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Iscool

Thank goodness there’s some Biblical churches left.

Do they put their hands together when they pray?


24 posted on 08/12/2007 4:00:27 PM PDT by D-fendr
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To: MarkBsnr
Disbelief in the Trinity will surely lead to hell.

Nonsense...People are saved by accepting Jesus Christ as their Savior...Understanding the process often comes later...

Creation of one’s own church will surely lead to hell.

More nonsense...I two or more are gathered together, Jesus is in the midst of the bunch...

When a person gets saved, he/she is the church...The Body...Has nothing to do with a religious organization of sinners, some possibly saved and some not...

The 'church' is spiritual...It is NOT physical...It doesn't matter how big and expensive your church is, or even if you have one... If you are not in the 'spiritual' church, you aren't in the church at all and you are not a Christian...

Privately interpreting Scripture will surely lead to hell.

As your church should well know since it is the King of private interpreters...But alas, you are wrong again...

Fortunately, you don't have to be right about too many things in the scripture other than the way to salvation...If you got THAT right, you'll still make it to Heaven, and lucky for you guys...

25 posted on 08/12/2007 4:08:04 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: AlaninSA
If you don’t understand Christianity, you’re unlikely to be able to be a Christian, Iscool.

I don't agree at all...All you need to know is that you are a sinner and that a God exists that can save you...And all you have to do is ask Him...

The Trinity is part of Christianity.

Yes, it certainly is...But knowing that will not save you...And not knowing that will not prevent you from getting saved...

26 posted on 08/12/2007 4:15:02 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: old republic
You are right, belief alone will save no one. The Epistle of James says, Faith without works is dead being alone. there just saying that we accept Jesus Christ does not mean that we are saved.

You start twisting things like that, someone's going to think you are a Catholic...

I did NOT say belief in Jesus Christ as your Saviour would not save you...I said belief in the Trinity as 1 in 3, and 3 in 1 will not save you...

Nice try though...

27 posted on 08/12/2007 4:19:16 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Mad Dawg
but I think the "royal road" to a deeper faith in the God who reveals Himself and His love to us is found in the Church.

Can't be...Your church would be nothing without the scripture, even tho it's (the scripture) severely abused...

There are plenty of folks that have a very 'deep faith' in God who never set foot in one of your churches but are fed directly thru the word of God, the scripture...

28 posted on 08/12/2007 4:24:42 PM PDT by Iscool (OK, I'm Back...Now what were your other two wishes???)
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To: Iscool

Yep, just say the sinner’s prayer. All ya gotta do. One time. It’s in the Bible.


29 posted on 08/12/2007 4:33:34 PM PDT by D-fendr
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To: Iscool

That’s right. You can believe God is four-in-twelve if you want and Jesus and The Father are cousins if you want. Don’t matter.

Trinity is just another of those traditions of men.


30 posted on 08/12/2007 4:43:34 PM PDT by D-fendr
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To: Iscool

I don’t see how your post contradicts mine — except for the “Can’t be” part. You put some other controversial statements in there, but while I disagree with them to some extent, they don’t have anything to do with what I said.


31 posted on 08/12/2007 4:44:40 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Iscool

OK, good. I thought you were denying the Trinity. My apologies. I fully agree with you that (a) “All you need to know is that you are a sinner and that a God exists that can save you...And all you have to do is ask Him...” and (b) “But knowing that will not save you...”

But you’re wrong on this point:

“And not knowing that will not prevent you from getting saved...”


32 posted on 08/12/2007 5:18:42 PM PDT by AlaninSA (In tabulario donationem feci.)
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To: AlaninSA
But you’re wrong on this point:

“And not knowing that will not prevent you from getting saved...”

Knowing that God is a Trinity in Unity will not save you. Satan knows that. (He may even understand it better than I do, which ain't hard.)

Not knowing it will not damn you, I think. You could not know it through invincible ignorance or other incapacity. You could have been given the grace to say the sinner's prayer and know as little about the Catholic Church and what she teaches as some of our antagonists here know (or even less), and not have their opportunities to learn. "A broken and contrite heart He will not despise." Willful ignorance on the other hand could prove to be mortal.

I think the "means of grace" provide immeasurable assistance, and sound doctrine is better and more useful than no or wrong doctrine.

33 posted on 08/12/2007 5:40:42 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Iscool
whoa.....slow down there. The sign of the cross is nothing more than an acknowledgment of that persons acceptance of the Holy Trinity and Yeshua.

No, the sign of the cross won’t save you....the faith that causes one to cross himself in honor of the Lord is what saves him.

Belief in the Holy Trinity is indeed belief in G_d in three distinct persons. Jesus himself breathed on them (the apostles) and began the work of the Holy Spirit in their lives.

34 posted on 08/12/2007 5:54:40 PM PDT by servantboy777
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To: Salvation

Excellent post, thank you...

...agreed...post #13 was an excellent response, albeit no doubt unheeded, to an insolent previous post...


35 posted on 08/13/2007 7:40:12 AM PDT by IrishBrigade
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To: Iscool

Your church would be nothing without the scripture, even tho it’s (the scripture) severely abused...

...a litle bit of detailed explanation of the above inane utterance would be of benefit...to us beknighted, uncool children of the papacy...


36 posted on 08/13/2007 7:52:31 AM PDT by IrishBrigade
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To: doc1019
And the “sign of the cross” as a personal unction, is found where in the Bible?

Doesn't the Bible tell us that it does not contain all of the works of Jesus Christ?

If it cannot contain all of His works, how could it contain all of the works of His Church?

37 posted on 08/13/2007 9:36:43 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Iscool
You can make the sign of the cross a million times a day...It surely won't save you...

And denying the Cross will? I think not.

38 posted on 08/13/2007 9:38:22 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Iscool
...but are fed directly thru the word of God, the scripture...

Good thing the Church you disdain assembled those New Testament books for you.

Or did they get that part wrong, too? Oh, dear!

39 posted on 08/13/2007 9:42:03 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: D-fendr
Trinity is just another of those traditions of men.

What!? How can a church claim to be a "Biblical church" if it doesn't believe in the Trinity?

40 posted on 08/13/2007 9:51:48 AM PDT by Pyro7480 ("Jesu, Jesu, Jesu, esto mihi Jesus" -St. Ralph Sherwin's last words at Tyburn)
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