Posted on 06/05/2007 10:53:58 AM PDT by Frank Sheed
I remember your first post. I had you pegged in one and you have not changed my mind. May God heal the minds and the hearts of self-righteous people, especially those on FR.
"And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen." -- John 21:25
God, however, chose not to inspire men to write every single thing that Christ did or said. So what? From everything we know He did and said we are sufficiently equipped to live a God-glorifying, obedient, joyful life.
This fact also does not permit us to make things up which is what the church in Rome does. It makes things up.
Paul is only saying what a great aid scripture is, but in no way is he defining sola scriptura.
"A great aid?" Why do you think Scripture is a "great aid?"
Scripture is God-breathed. Scripture is the primary means by which God ordained the Holy Spirit to reach His children. Christ spoke by Scripture. Christ was Scripture, the word of God made flesh.
...the distinctive and the controversial doctrines or practices of the Roman Catholic Church (the distinctive and controversial doctrines, and practices of the Roman Church) are all founded solely upon alleged tradition! Purgatory, the mass, transubstantiation, indulgences, the treasury of merit, penance, the rosary, prayers to Mary, holy water, the papacy, and on and on. Those things which are distinctive to the Roman Catholic Church, you will find, that when you get into debates with Roman Catholics, they appeal not to biblical exegesis to support, but they appeal to this alleged Apostolic Oral Tradition that supposed to still be alive in the Church. And I think that's just asking a bit too much of anybody to expect that those heavy and controversial points could be founded not upon an objective Word from God (in the way that we've seen at the beginning of tonight's lecture), but to be founded upon an unverifiable, subjectively adduced tradition that is said to be Apostolic...""...I am convinced (as Luther was convinced) that if we give up sola Scriptura, we will inevitably give up sola Gratia as well. Because the giving up of the Protestant authority (the principle of sola Scriptura) simply opens the door for other ways of pleasing God to enter in that are not based upon His own revelation. And it's a very short step from thinking that I can follow a religious tradition that cannot be verified objectively by the Word of God to the idea that I can please God by something that He has not provided. It is a very short step from the denial of sola Scriptura to the denial of sola Gratia when it comes to salvation....
Perhaps you may find peace and devotion in the Jesus Prayer that Orthodox Christians pray on their prayer ropes. Before I discovered the Orthodox Church I had begun to pray the Prayer of the Publican. It was about a year later (praise God) that I discovered the Orthodox Church to discover the Jesus Prayer which has been prayed since before the Great Schism.
Your right. It is a good book, and certainly a fascinating testimony. A Roman Catholic friend loaned it to me after he read it.
As a protestant I always believed, and was taught, that the Saints will reign in heaven. However, I NEVER really thought of Mary as a Saint. Turns out that by my own protestant theology she does indeed reign. It’s also not really a contradiction (I had thought the same.) because the Greeks thought Paul had some power of his own, but he corrected them. It was Christ working through him as he does his mother. Truly he fulfilled ALL the law in honoring her.
Start reading the earliest church writings, and you will soon find your way home. I started with Polycarp Bishop of Smyrna, and Ignatius Bishop of Antioch both of whom KNEW the Apostles. No mumbo-jumbo there...
Glory be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit. As it was in the beginning is now, and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And Fr. Mod called you a zot.
I hope you get to come back when you cool down.
why should an anti-protestant thread be allowed to go forward without any input from protestants. Absurd.
Every one of these “i returned to Rome”, “I pray the Rosary even though I’m a Protestant,” and “I’m a Mariologist Calvinist” threads is anti-protestant.
Fortunately, someone with half an ounce of sense has seen that people will defend their religion when it gets attacked. The rules are no profanity, no personal attacks, and no racism or violence.
That’s exactly the same as the rest of Free Republic. In fact, it’s monitored much more closely here, and the rest of FR is quite a bit rougher.
They may have gone away but they’re back now, at least in every Catholic church I’ve been in. Parishioners also demanded the return of the Stations of the Cross, and kneelers in most cases.
As far back as *I* can remember! :)
The Transfiguration, when the disciples saw Elijah and Moses with Jesus, might have given them a clue that not everybody is asleep up there, but I don't really have an answer for you.
The PResbyterians pray “forgive us our debts” because any good Scotsman would rather have his debts forgiven than his trespasses.
Don't you think Jesus might have had a clue before then & if we were to pray to them, some mention of it would have made its way into Scripture? Why do we pray for other Christians? It's scriptural, but besides that, what do you think it does *to* us? Do you guys ever pray *for* the saints? There are a lot of prayers to Mary, but are there any that you say that are for her?
I remember seeing kneelers in Catholic churches when I was a kid, but I don’t remember using them during Mass at all. In my own church they were used several times during every service. The church that I’m in now doesn’t have any.
On another thread it was noted that there are a large number of Catholics ready to give Mary the official and irrevocable and ex cathedra place of "co-Redeemer" with Christ thus giving to Mary credit for both the work (sola Christus) and the Glory (Sola Deo Gloria) of salvation.
Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. (Mark 7:13 KJV)
I know we’re nowhere near getting our initial product to market, but I was thinking about another possible product. If we added a line of prayer rugs & added a practice of praying 5 times a day in the direction of Calvary, it might make converting some Muslims to Christianity more doable. Embrace some of their rituals & it would ease their transition.
Prayer rugs has been done and these people might keep the rugs they have, thus depriving us of the our ability to convince them that they need OUR prayer rugs.
I would suggest perhaps a set of Holy Quilted Knee Pads. Kind of like a combination prayer rug and kneeling bar.
That way, people could just strap them on and fall to their knees whenever they get the uncontrollable urge to do the "Cardery"... like when they have two pair and the guy across the table has just gone all in.
Many of the wreckovated churches of the wigam don’t have them. These are also typically the churches that have put the Presence in a closet. I don’t like worshipping in those places because the tile gets really hard on my knees.
Why would we need to pray FOR the Saints? The whole reason we feel confident in praying to them is because we’re confident they’re already in heaven, happy with Jesus.
Has it ever occurred to you that when your pastor stands up there and prays HIS prayer and you sit there with your head bowed, that he’s interceding for you? Why do you have your preacher intercede for you? Aren’t your own prayers good enough? Or is it because you think he has the “right” words? Yeah, I thought so.
And why bother praying for others? Aren’t you interceding for them? Let them pray for themselves! If they are among God’s elect, He will know his own.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.