Posted on 02/05/2007 10:35:59 AM PST by MichaelTheeArchAngel
What part of the word NO dont you understand. I checked "YOUR" Hebrew text and it was not there, IN THE HEBREW. IT WAS NOT THERE. I used my books on Hebrew to see if it was there. It was not there. It is indeed AIT: assisted in translation. In other words not really there.
The Jews and everyone else thinks it's there. I really don't care what you say about it, because what you say doesn't match the reality of the matter. If you don't like that, take it up with the Jews. Demand that they correct and change their translations, and make sure to teach them the proper way to read Hebrew, so they don't make any more mistakes like this again.
Its flattering how tenaciously you're sticking up for us. Does that mean you no longer believe in the deity of Jesus as well?
Ofcourse it is, it is a 1Person common plural.
It is translated 'let us' in Joshua 22:26 and 2Ki.4:10.
'Let us' is referring to the person of the verb (1st common Plural).
There was one criminal at either side of Christ so the translation is correct and is in every major translation that I have checked, modern and pre-1611.
That there may have been more than two criminals is possible, but there were at least two, one on each side of Christ.
Let us be clear here: This is how the Jews on their own website translate Genesis 1:26 from the Hebrew into the English:
26 And God said: 'Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.'
The Hebrew scholars of Jewish persuasion see the "let us" in the form of that Hebrew verb. It is a first person plural.
Now, let us move on to your next problem: the word: "our". Are you going to say that the word "our" is missing in Genesis 1:26 as well? How come the Jewish translators can see these words in their own scriptures and you can't. They don't like the fact that they are there because it is hard for them deal with and for their rabbis to adequately explain, but they know that that is how the scriptures of Moses clearly read.
Do you have some kind of theological blinders on? Tell us where this passage is translated correctly according to your theology.
I agree with you 1000 silverlings, after reading this thread, Four verses just jumped out at me. The first was 1- Cor. 10:12 "Let he who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall" (N.A.S.) Getting back to faith for a moment, Hebrews 11:1 says in the King James version " Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Our small minds can not yet fathom the exact nature of God. The one thing I don't think I'll ever understand, but I just plain believe, is how three distinct entities can be one. I believe God in Heaven, after many prophets were rejected by mankind, decided to come down to Earth himself, to show us how much he loves us, to break the reign of sin that Adam had initiated, and to show us how to live our lives in a way that we would have a more intimate relationship with him. He came down and in although in the full nature of God, was born as a man. He needed to live a sinless life in order to defeat the power of sin over mankind, right on through to the end of his earthly life. Having done this, Being God, he rose again from the dead.(Something else I don't think I'll ever quite understand, I just believe that it happened) and so returning to heaven, but leaving behind part of himself, the Comforter, Or Holy Spirit (also God) to fill, guide, protect and convict us. To be part of our whole being, to live within us. Hebrews 11:6 (N.I.V.)-" And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him". 2nd Timothy 2:23 (N.A.S.) "but refuse foolish and endless speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels" or the N.I.V. states it this way " Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels" the next verse says " And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful." If we try to have all the answers and "proof" of the nature of God why would we need faith at all? God wants people who honestly love him and trust him to live with him in eternity, I don't think he approves of "know-it-alls" but I know he love them just the same Because God is not a respecter of persons. He loves all people equally, not willing that any of us should perish, but that we should all live with him for eternity. BUT he gave us all a free will to choose or believe what we want to, and also do as we please anything our hearts or minds desire, but not without consequence. He WILL separate the wheat from the tares, because we can't work or connive our way into heaven or live a life of Godlessness and think all is well. This is serious business. I don't know where the exact verse is but I think it was Paul who said "Let each person work out his own salvation with fear and trembling" or something like that. Somewhere else I remember someone saying, either one of the Apostles or Jesus. " The fear of the Lord is the beginning of understanding" (or wisdom) Even though the word trinity is not in the bible the concept is all throughout. God the Father, his son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit(or Comforter) are all one in the same, but yet distinct in their own unique natures. I guess we'll understand it more clearly when we get to heaven. You either believe that God's word is true and inerrant as laid down by the holy spirit through men or you don't. Romans 10:17 says (K.J.V.) " So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the WORD of God".
"Paragraphs are our friends!"
Amen Rainwaves.
"Now, let us move on to your next problem: the word: "our". Are you going to say that the word "our" is missing in Genesis 1:26 as well?" "LET US" not change the subject about the words "LET US" not being in the HEBREW scripture. Why dont you get out your own books on Hebrew and look to see if the words "Let us" are there. Then you can tell every one here what you found.
The reason the word "Elohiym" is plurl, is because translated it says "God of the living." Living, being the other people of heaven and earth. The word El for God alone is singular. Just because God has many name titles, that does not make Him more than one person. God the Father is Holy Spirit.
[Genesis 1:27] And God prepareth the man in His image; in the image of God He prepared him, a male and a female He prepared them.
[Genesis 1:29] And God saith, 'Lo, I have given to you every herb sowing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree in which [is] the fruit of a tree sowing seed, to you it is for food.
[Genesis 1:31] And God seeth all that He hath done, and lo, very good; and there is an evening, and there is a morning -- day the sixth.
[Genesis 2:2] And God completeth by the seventh day His work which He hath made, and ceaseth by the seventh day from all His work which He hath made.
[Genesis 2:3] And God blesseth the seventh day, and sanctifieth it, for in it He hath ceased from all His work which God had prepared for making.
[Genesis 2:8] And Jehovah God planteth a garden in Eden, at the east, and He setteth there the man whom He hath formed;
Well.....I could go on and on.....but I think everyone gets the idea. After 1:26 what happens to the plural noun, Elohim? It becomes singular! Any thoughts?
No problem, like I said the name word Elohiym means "God of the living", The word "living" is refering to all that live. It does not mean that God is plural, because the word "El" is singular. He who is singular is God of the plural.
I have re-read the entire thread and my pings in/out-- and my Freepmail... and received no specific communications from you about these apologetic resources.
I think you have intended to ask the above question (#295) of someone else.
Have a great day...
The Trinity is strongly implied by Scripture from Genesis thru revelation. Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all spoken of in Scriptural text. The Church's doctrine of the Trinity does not stretch beyond what is reasonable.
If you are Christian, you accept and believe in the Trinity. If you are not Christian, then don't. Otherwise you are like the man who wants to be in the army but does not want to march.
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1Ti 2:6 who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony given at the proper time.
This is interesing read!
You are all trying to count how many in the Trinity?
Now you have the traditional 3 in one God!
Now you have
1-God the Father who is a spirit!
2-Only begotten Son Jesus Christ who now has a resurrected body of Flesh and Bone.
3- the Holy Spirit and who is the Holy Ghost
So when resurrected Jesus now of Flesh and Bone return to His Father of Spirit, Jesus sat on the right hand side of God the Father a Spirit!
So the 3 in One spirits are now
Spirit Father, Resurrected Son and the Holy Ghost!
To clear up some confusion of what is pagan and what is Divine.
A Pagan Sacrifice would be human or beast etc.
Where as a Divine Sacrifice was to be be a great and last sacrifice also it must be an infinite and eternal sacrifice.
So the Father, Son and Holy Ghost are Divine being of the Godhead. So trinity would not qualitfy to be Pagan.
Be sides the Godhead is not human.
Jesus was of both the son of man and the Son of God.
No human has that parentage!
You have cleared up nothing....and I don't think we are talkin' sacrifice here!
All Pagan religions from the time of Babylon, have adopted in one form or another a trinity doctrine or a triad or trinity of gods. In Babylon it was Nimrod, Semiramas, and Tammuz; In Egypt it was Osiris, Isis, and Horus; within Israel pagan gnosticism it was Kether, Hokhmah, and Binah; In Plato's philosophy it was the Unknown Father, Nous/Logos, and the world soul. But in Old Testament Judaism there was only One God, a numerical ONE.
If you cannot see that the Nicean council adopted this heresy as a convenience and established an un Biblical creed to support it.....well....what can I say? You are simply following pagan doctrine established by the Roman church. So be it.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.