[kosta50]

I have never given credit to the Church Fathers for putting together the Bible in the sense that the Church Fathers "created the Bible"

Well, they were the ones who collected, selected and protected the writings you read as the New Testament. They didn't write them, but without them we would have no clue which of the 200-plus scrolls represent the New Testament for sure.

The Apostles did not 'put together' the Christian canon; the Church did. The Apostles wrote it, and we believe that God inspired them to write the truth, as we believe that God guided the Fathers in selecting, recognizing, safeguarding and putting together that which the Apostles wrote into what you now consider God's Word of the New Testament.

As for the validity of the deuterocanonical books, one of the best reasons I can think of why the Church included them is the fact that the concept of the devil as the embodiment of all evil, and of a fallen angel who rebelled against God, comes from them and finds its place in the New Testament.

For sure, such is not the case with the Old Testament. The concept of a 'devil' does not exist in Judaism. The ha-satan of Judaism is a willing servant of God. The Jews deny that an angel – albeit a noëtic being – can have free will and rebel against God..

Thus, throughout Judaism, ha-satan is a loyal angel of God, who was created by God to tempt us. Jews often quote Job (probably one of the oldest books of the OT) where this ha-satan is portrayed as a member in good standing with God.

The concept that satan is the devil appears in the deuterocanonical books and from them in the New Testament, which means that the Apostles used them.

[HarleyD]

The Apostles did not 'put together' the Christian canon; the Church did.

Actually, the Church's position on this is that they did not 'put together' the Christian canon; instead they 'confirmed' the canon. A subtle but significant difference.

For sure, such is not the case with the Old Testament. The concept of a 'devil' does not exist in Judaism.

Job 1:6-8 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that [there is] none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

I wouldn't say it doesn't exist. It is, perhaps, minimized which I would agree with. Christians place too much emphasis on the devil and not enough on our failings.

The early Church recognized the inspiration of the Old Testament as well as the New. The rejection of the Old Testament is, in part, a heretical view know as Marcionism.

The Jews deny that an angel – albeit a noëtic being – can have free will and rebel against God.

I'm not that familiar with ancient Jewish teaching (it has changed) but if this is what they believe, I would agree. Angels do not and never had free will, nor can they rebel against God. But clearly the Jews, at least in Job, understood there to be fallen angels. This creates a problem for those who believe in free will. How could perfect beings, like the angels or Adam fall? If they're perfect and they have free will, won't they always make the perfect decision?

[Quix]

My construction on reality is

that Holy Spirit preserved and decided the Canon.

He could have probably used . . .

donkeys, monkeys, rocks . . .

to do so . . . given His ability to raise up rocks as children of Abraham.

[Forest Keeper]

The concept that satan is the devil appears in the deuterocanonical books and from them in the New Testament, which means that the Apostles used them.

If it worked that way, isn't it curious that they are never quoted in the NT? I have no problem with the Apostles knowing the Septuagint, and I don't think a quote in the NT is necessary to validate an OT work. I just have a hard time believing that the NT presentation of satan is BASED on the deuterocanonicals. Inspiration means that the ultimate basis of the writings was God Himself, rather than other works.