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To: HarleyD; Kolokotronis; .30Carbine

Hardly Harley. You and FK keep repeating the same nonsense (based on what the Reformed theology teaches). But you are not answering the question.

It was you who once said that we are who, where, and what we are because God wants it so. Your prayer, asking for guidance, whatever, did nothing to predetermine where, who and what you will be.

Reformed theology teaches that you have been a finished product before you were born, destined to either hell or heaven, and that nothing you do changes or affects what will happen to you.

Praying is work. Do you think your work is necessary for God to lead you? +Paul didn't say pray; he said believe. Is faith not enough for your salvation, HD? Is faith in God and trust that He is just and merciful not enought to lead you?

Do you think not praying will change your destiny, change who you are, where you are and why you are? Do you think "knowing" what the Father wants from you is necessary for your salvation? Obviosuly not! Since you were "saved" before you were even born, right? And can your "knowing" what the Father wants change that? Obviously not!

If God is always sovereign, why would your prayers affect anything? In your theology they don't and they can't. Is it His will that matters or your "knowing" His will that matters? Obviously, only His will counts; your knowing His will (even if that were possible) changes zilch where you will end up.

So, once again, why do the Reformed pray?

15,639 posted on 06/09/2007 7:11:47 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Kolokotronis; .30Carbine
Praying is work. Do you think your work is necessary for God to lead you?

Can you show me where praying is work? I don't consider it working at all; rather it's more like a conversation.

Do you think not praying will change your destiny, change who you are, where you are and why you are? Do you think "knowing" what the Father wants from you is necessary for your salvation? Obviosuly not!

No. From my perspective I would like a certain person to come to know Christ. I have been praying that God will help this person come to Christ. Now do you think God will answer my prayer? Do you think I'm praying outside of God's will? From your perspective I'm not and by all account God should grant my petition. But what happens if He doesn't? How do you justify my prayer not being answered?

Rather from my perspective God has already ordain those who will come to Him. Consequently, my prayer for the salvation of this individual is for my edification. If this person comes to Christ, I can celebrate that God has answer my prayer and this one lost soul has been transformed into a new creature to share all eternity in heaven. If this person does not come to Christ, God still has answered my prayer. I can satisfy myself in the knowledge that the will of the Father is done and know this was what is best-even though I might not understand it.

So, once again, why do the Reformed pray?

The real question is why does the synergist pray for the salvation of others when it overrides their will.

15,642 posted on 06/09/2007 12:57:00 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: kosta50
So, once again, why do the Reformed pray?

For me, it's like I can't not pray. Praying is work, only in that it is an action. Only when prayer is results oriented does it become work work.

Do you communicate with your loved ones, only because or when you expect there to be some kind of effect on you or them?

When you see an example of the beauty of His creation, how can you not express your awe about His greatness to Him? How can you not thank Him for showing it to you? When He has given you comfort, stilled your fears, how can you not express that to Him? When He has provided for you, how can you remain silent, taking Him for granted? When I screw up, I can't not express my remorse to Him, cuz it eats away at me.

15,643 posted on 06/09/2007 1:33:34 PM PDT by GoLightly
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