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To: fortheDeclaration
I didn't say that every Roman Catholic or Orthodox follower was spiritually dead.

Forth, Do you know what a "Church" is? It is a community of believers. Not a building. Not a denomination. It is the individuals of the community. Thus, when you say

"your 'Church' is as 'spiritually dead as they are"

You are saying the entire community is spiritually dead. Is that the wisest thing to say? I don't think so. I think such comments demand at least an apology and a clarification.

The doctrines of both Churches are dead, depending on the traditons of men, rather than the words of God (Mk.7:7-10).

That is your personal opinions, which, quite frankly, totally ignores YOUR traditions of men, such as Sola Scriptura, an invention of MEN of the 1500's that ironically is not found in the Bible anywhere, and Sola Fide, an invention of MEN of the 1500's that is DENIED EXPLICITLY in the Bible, in particular, James 2.

Don't bother with your lame explanations. I've heard them and I am not in the mood to get sick on a weekend...

Look to the beam in your eye, forth, look to the beam...

Regards

13,938 posted on 05/04/2007 7:24:45 AM PDT by jo kus (Humility is present when one debases oneself without being obliged to do so- St.Chrysostom; Phil 2:8)
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To: jo kus
I didn't say that every Roman Catholic or Orthodox follower was spiritually dead. Forth, Do you know what a "Church" is? It is a community of believers. Not a building. Not a denomination. It is the individuals of the community. Thus, when you say "your 'Church' is as 'spiritually dead as they are" You are saying the entire community is spiritually dead. Is that the wisest thing to say? I don't think so. I think such comments demand at least an apology and a clarification.

No, a 'church' has two connotations.

One, is the Church as the Body of Christ and that connotation is spiritual.

Thus, only believers in Christ enter into that relationship with Him, being 'born again'.

That is the Church as 'organism', growing and alive.

The other connotation of a church is as an organization.

An unbeliever can be a member of that type of church, as many are.

Now, a organizational 'church' that does not teach the truth of God's saving grace, and substitutes man's traditions for God's truth is a dead church.

The doctrines of both Churches are dead, depending on the traditions of men, rather than the words of God (Mk.7:7-10).

That is your personal opinions, which, quite frankly, totally ignores YOUR traditions of men, such as Sola Scriptura, an invention of MEN of the 1500's that ironically is not found in the Bible anywhere, and Sola Fide, an invention of MEN of the 1500's that is DENIED EXPLICITLY in the Bible, in particular, James 2.

Christ preached Sola Scriptura.

As for Sola Fide, it is very much taught in the New Testament by Paul (not of works-lest any man should boast) and James is not speaking of works leading to eternal life.

So, your constant appeal to James to avoid what Paul clearly states only shows your determination to reject the truth.

Don't bother with your lame explanations. I've heard them and I am not in the mood to get sick on a weekend...

Funny, you can't refute those explanations, nor can you explain away what Paul is clearly stating.

Look to the beam in your eye, forth, look to the beam...

And you ought to look to the scriptures and learn from the failure of the Jews,

But Israel which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone...They have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge for they being ignorant of God's righteousness and going about to establish their own righteousness have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. (Rom.9:31-32,10:2-4)

Regards

Likewise.

14,085 posted on 05/07/2007 4:30:18 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration (For what saith the scripture? (Rom.4:3))
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