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To: kosta50
Who gave your children the soul? Is not God the Creator of everything and all? Did God not give soul to every human being? Are you saying some souls God gives are evil?

Yes, God is the creator of everything and all. I do not think of God as doling out "evil souls". The soul, as manufactured, does not include evil, for that would make God the author of evil. The Bible teaches that aside from Eve, all subsequent men are stained by the sin of Adam. All are doomed to perish, but not for our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

If God did not create the 'goats,' who did? Are you saying there is another 'creator' competing with God?

No, God created the goats. There is no other creator. He just did not predestine them to be of the elect. The stain of Adam and their own sins, if any, are what condemn them. Praise God that He decided to save any of us.

FK: "If all people are God's children, then God is a terrible Father."

And making people expressly destined (before they were even conceived) for eternal suffering in hell is not??!!

No, we are God's creation. He is free to do with us as He pleases. We have no rights. You are assigning duties and responsibilities to God for the fact of creating us. What standing have you to do this?

Isa 29:16 : 16 You turn things upside down, as if the potter were thought to be like the clay! Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, "He did not make me"? Can the pot say of the potter, "He knows nothing"?

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FK: "We say God does indeed intervene for His real children, the elect."

He does? How so? I thought the Reformed believe that God settled what happens before there even was a Creation, and will not change His plan. What is there to 'intervene' about?

Yes, God settled everything from the beginning. That includes certain things that happen within time, such as the crucifixion. Another thing that happens is that God graces His elect such that they will turn to Him and become "saved" within time. The elect are not born in a "saved state", although it is a certainty that they will become saved during their lives.

11,055 posted on 02/23/2007 4:39:19 PM PST by Forest Keeper
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To: Forest Keeper
Yes, God is the creator of everything and all

Good. We agree on the basics!

I do not think of God as doling out "evil souls"

That's good too.

The soul, as manufactured, does not include evil, for that would make God the author of evil.

Except for 'manufactured' that is good too.

The Bible teaches that aside from Eve, all subsequent men are stained by the sin of Adam

I knew this had to end. Where is the stain? On the body? No, of course not. On the soul? But I thought that God 'manufactures' the souls. If they are good after God makes them, when do they get 'stained?' [I have an idea, but I want to see what you say].

God created the goats. There is no other creator. He just did not predestine them to be of the elect

First he makes them, even 'manufactures' thee souls, then He throws them on a trash pile to burn in hell forever?

Some seem to believe in a monster who happnes to like them. Yet the Bible tells us God is not partial.

We are God's creation. He is free to do with us as He pleases. We have no rights

YOU said that would make Him a terrible Father, FK. Sounds like you judged as much as I did. I guess that makes both of us unfit to be even clay?

Yes, God settled everything from the beginning

Okay, then no intervention is necessary because His plan is not bound to go wrong! All those events you mention are simple sequences in His plan, not interventions. An intervention means interference.

11,064 posted on 02/23/2007 9:27:41 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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