Posted on 12/04/2006 7:52:47 PM PST by Pyro7480
Another example of egalitarianism. No one is more righteous or more wicked than anyone else, except Christ. We're all the same. It is a theological communism akin to Animal Farm.
-A8
You point to a very real difference between the Catholic and Orthodox faith on one hand, the Protestantism on the other. In this instance the difference appears a defect of the sacramental apostolic churches. But I don't want the whole depth of the difference to be left without comment.
It is sown in corruption, it shall rise in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonour, it shall rise in glory. It is sown in weakness, it shall rise in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it shall rise a spiritual body. If there be a natural body, there is also a spiritual body, as it is written: 45 The first man Adam was made into a living soul; the last Adam into a quickening spirit. 46 Yet that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; afterwards that which is spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, earthly: the second man, from heaven, heavenly. 48 Such as is the earthly, such also are the earthly: and such as is the heavenly, such also are they that are heavenly. 49 Therefore as we have borne the image of the earthly, let us bear also the image of the heavenly. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot possess the kingdom of God: neither shall corruption possess incorruption. (1 Cor 15)The actual word St. Paul uses here, thranslated as "natural" is "psychikos". The meaning is that of the phychological nature, or of the passion, and it is contrasted tot he "pneumatikos", the spiritual. Our passions are to die, our spirit is to rise. St. Paul often returns to this theme, as he teaches to avoid anger and combat other strong emotions and attachments. This distinction, between the passionate and the spiritual, is reflected in the absence of emotion that is characteristic of the Catholic and Orthodox liturgy. Symmetrically, the evengelical service is often highly emotionally charged. Many complain about the absence of passion in Catholic service as indifference, -- they do not feel as if they are being fed. A supercharge experience of an evangelical altar call is a frequent basis of people joining evangelical churches. In contrast, a good priest serves as if the congregation is not there.
This is just the way things are.
There you have it.
That is a non sequitur. And second, there is nothing in Scripture that teaches 'sola scriptura', but you revel in that "dangerous fiction".
-A8
It is amusing how this verse is cited as sayiong something against the veneration of saints, when the entire passage calls for intercessory prayer:
1 I desire therefore, first of all, that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men: 2 For kings, and for all that are in high station: that we may lead a quiet and a peaceable life in all piety and chastity. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour, 4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus:
Of course. This is the Catholic teaching. But why is it giving us an image of God? The Church responds, in order to give us a foretaste of heaven, where we unite with Christ. Very well then, is Mary united with Christ? Of course she is, -- she is His mother. What other foretaste could she need?
The teaching of perpetual virginity can be questioned as something not directly found in the Scripture. But do not question it on grounds of illogicality.
And yet you imagine God keeps score of our transgressions and tallies them up at the end of our lives to see which men have made the cut. And that's why it's important to be absolved on earth of as many sins as possible; to confess every wrong; to swallow every wafer; to count every bead.
Ultimately, it must be a terrible strain, adding and subtracting the good you do from the debt you owe.
Relax, A8. You can never redeem yourself. Neither you nor me nor Mary could be good enough for heaven. Only Christ's goodness has saved us. Christ has grabbed the check and paid for your sins, every one of them.
Rejoice.
You have a child, don't you? I ask because I know that those with children probably understand such a loss perhaps even better than I do, in a way, because I was his sister and not his mother.
My mother is a remarkable woman, she said she felt like our Lord's Blessed Mother at my brother's feet. He was hit and killed very close to where we lived. His friends came up the driveway calling, "Patrick's been hit". We ran to him, and my Mom became incontinent because she knew, and I knew he was dead.
Thank you for letting me speak of him, it does my heart good, especially at this time of the year.
And to whom are we to make our prayers and thanksgivings?
To "the one Mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus."
Oh please. Say what you will about Luther, he kept his hands very busy.
There are massive amounts of Scripture asserting Sola Scriptura.
And those with eyes to see and ears to hear will read the Bible and understand with a new heart given by God alone as the Holy Spirit guides their path.
There is nothing in Scripture about Mary being "immaculate." All Scripture points to the contrary.
You offer Matthew 6:7-8 which only says that the Father knows before you ask. If you read this verse as saying someting against mediation you have to conclude that it speaks against mediation of Jesus Christ as well.
That's because I'm not interested in Luther's opinion about Mary. I'm not interested in what anyone's catechism says. I'm not interested in what some ancient priest said. I'm not interested in what Billy Graham says. I'm not interested in what any of the popes said.
I am interested in what God's Word says. :-)
-A8
Just what the Mormons said to defend the Book of Mormon.
Same gnosticism, different sect.
-A8
I don't think the minister's reaction was due to any overly-emotional "alter call" type of experience.
I think the minister's tears were because he had children of his own and he was experiencing AG's mother's pain along with her.
It would be difficult to look at a lifeless child and not see your own child's face. (I can hardly type these sentences. I can only grasp at the reality.)
AG, you and your mother will see Patrick again in heaven. Forever.
Illogical question. She was sinless because she had a Savior.
It is wrong if they do. Mary was perpetually a virgin because of the same reason we enjoy marital sex: proximity to God.
Interesting perspective. However, the God of the Bible impresses me as seriously passionate. The notion that shutting down the emotions makes us "higher" creatures sounds more like Buddhism than Christianity.
No bait; no switch -- just Bible.
The bible says "she gave birth." That means that "she gave birth."
When her conception of Jesus was different, the bible pointed it out.
Words mean something. I don't believe I'm discussing this. Just be honest with you, it's unnecessary. Virgins are virgins because they haven't engaged in sex. The aren't virgins because they have intact hymens.
Will you agree that a horse-riding young girl whose hymen ruptures is a sexually experienced young lady?
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