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To: kosta50; Kolokotronis

I guess I am too firmly rooted in this world.

My heroes are the Saints - warriors of the spirit - but also the warriors of the flesh guided by the spirit.

And may I add from this essay about "just war" and Orthodoxy. Constantine Cyril - the Apostle to the Slavs- guides me in my understanding - as incomplete as it is...

http://www.theandros.com/justwar.html


36 posted on 11/19/2006 6:58:44 PM PST by eleni121 ( + En Touto Nika! By this sign conquer! + Constantine the Great))
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To: eleni121; Kolokotronis
I guess I am too firmly rooted in this world

That's you choice.

As for the heroes, we wish to imitate the Saints. As monastic clearly, they held themselves to a higher standard. Again, it is a judgment call what is better in the eyes of (the Christian) God: to follow the sample of +Polycarp and +Ignatius, and numerous others, or to become a crusader. The Church is very clear on that. The two Fathers you mention are speculating, and giving their religious opinions (theologoumenna). The key word in both of their arguments is that it is possible for a Christian, who engages in warfare, to be saved. Of course, with God everything is possible! But the Church also makes it very clear which action is morally closer to what Christ taught and, ultimately, what a true Christian must consider.

We are all at at different stages of cleaving to the world as we seek salvation with God's help. The degree of our disbelief, the emptiness of our prayers, is directly proportional to how much we cleave to the world. Which is fine, since it is, after all, our decision.

The opinions of individual Fathers, however, cannot be taken as gospel. Nor do their pinions represent official dogma of the Church. So, while the Saints speculated on many a subject, not all their speculations are "the Faith once delivered." +Augustine is an excellent example that this is indeed so, for while the Orthodox Church recognizes him as a Saint, his contribution to the Faith of the Seven Councils is rather minimal.

Likewise, one of the Capadoccian Fathers postulated that even the evil souls will eventually be saved. That is certainly not the position of the Church and has been. While God did not prepare hell for mankind, but satan and his demons, there will be those men who will walk right into hell all on their own account. And when they do, since repentance after death is not possible, they will stay there.

37 posted on 11/19/2006 7:53:58 PM PST by kosta50 (Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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