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To: HarleyD; Terabitten; wmfights; Lord_Calvinus; Frumanchu; Gamecock; AlbionGirl; adiaireton8; ...
Our failings in directly obeying His commands underscores our weaknesses and should lead us to repent on a daily basis pleading for His divine help.

Yes, our failings are our own and prove our inability to keep all the law.

Likewise, our sanctification is by the will of God, in order to prove it all true...

"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." Romans 12:2

Our obedience proves the truth of Christ risen, proves the Holy Spirit within us, proves that God changes the dead heart into a heart of flesh that will obey and glorify His name.

Adiaireton8 asks how we can know our salvation is true? The answer is that if God "renews your mind," you will prove it true.

If not, you won't.

57 posted on 11/15/2006 12:49:40 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg (("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose))
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Adiaireton8 asks how we can know our salvation is true? The answer is that if God "renews your mind," you will prove it true. If not, you won't.

The question is, what counts as "proving it"? If it is merely persevering till death, then not until death can we know that we are elect. But if "proving it" is not merely persevering till death, then how can we know now that we are saved (since we don't know now that we will persevere till death)?

-A8

61 posted on 11/15/2006 1:01:46 PM PST by adiaireton8 ("There is no greater evil one can suffer than to hate reasonable discourse." - Plato, Phaedo 89d)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
Yes, our failings are our own and prove our inability to keep all the law.

Doesn't matter to those who have a stake, both of power and money in convincing us that it is within our power to keep the law. Confess, get a priest's absolution. Confess, get a priest's absolution. Confess, get a priest's absolution, and on and on and on. It's a slick version of 'sin boldly.' Power and mediating the salvation of a person is their aphrodisiac and their disorder.

66 posted on 11/15/2006 1:10:12 PM PST by AlbionGirl ('Cause when they own the information, they can bend it all they want.')
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To: Dr. Eckleburg; Terabitten; wmfights; Lord_Calvinus; Frumanchu; Gamecock; AlbionGirl; adiaireton8; ..
Our obedience proves the truth of Christ risen, proves the Holy Spirit within us, proves that God changes the dead heart into a heart of flesh that will obey and glorify His name.

Yes, but this person felt that in order for us to be obedient we must be submissive which requires repentance. I find this to be a rather intriguing argument. Notice in your verse:

We first must be transformed in renewing our minds so that we may then prove what is good and acceptable. We can only be obedient to the Father upon repenting and we must confess our sins daily to Him. This seems like a simple concept in humbling ourselves before God sovereignty, but I must say that I didn't really tie obedience into a constant repenting.

By the way, we are to repent and submit to God's sovereign will-not our own. He didn't have very nice things to say about the "name it, claim it" crowd.

103 posted on 11/15/2006 4:26:54 PM PST by HarleyD (Mat 19:11 "But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.)
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