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To: grey_whiskers

Hi grey_whiskers

Mine are too, that is, my whiskers, and what few hairs I have left, are grey.

I would never attack "Christianity" for the very reasons given in the article, and also because I do not attack things. My only way of dealing with others is reason.

My "beef" is with the concept of forgiveness itself, whether its found in Christianity or some bleeding heart liberal's rant, it's contrary to two concepts which are fundamental to a correct ethics--namely justice and personal responsibility. In most cases, forgiveness is the equivalent of letting someone off the hook for something that ought to have a price (consequence), but in all cases where there is a price, if the one who entails it does not pay it, it means someone else has to. For example, when some welfare mother has one bastard child after another and the public is required to support them. They're forgiven their "mistake" at someone else's expense.

I never want forgiveness. In fact I would consider it an insult. I bear the consequences of my wrong choices, even when they are made in ignorance, a condition I strive continually to avoid. Bearing the consequences of my own wrong choices means I know I have a right to the benefit of all my right choices, that what I enjoy in this life I've earned by my own effort and it is mine by right. It also prevents me from having the illusion that dominates most of today's society, that one can do wrong and get away with it, or that one has a right to anything they have not earned.

Hank


64 posted on 10/28/2006 10:50:15 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
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To: Hank Kerchief
My "beef" is with the concept of forgiveness itself, whether its found in Christianity or some bleeding heart liberal's rant, it's contrary to two concepts which are fundamental to a correct ethics--namely justice and personal responsibility.

As an atheist, your very axioms and presuppositions preclude me from profitably discussing this point with you--but it rests in nature and power of God.

It is risky to go around forgetting about temporal consequences. Some Christian circles even have a name for it, "sloppy agape." OTOH, without forgiveness, there is no chance for "justice to be tempered with mercy". You run the risk of an over-emphasis on legalistic approaches without the chance for people to "pay their debt to society".

The problem is that the best approach is not "either-or" but "both-and"; and knowing WHEN to be harsh, and when not.

That wisdom is often beyond humans.

Cheers!

68 posted on 10/28/2006 1:25:04 PM PDT by grey_whiskers
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