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To: GSlob
The Western Civ grew out of Western christianity, but outgrew it when the civilization assumed its secular orientation. This orientation and the Western individualistic focus have been the cause of all Western progress since the Renaissance at least.

Substitute "abandonded" or "cast aside" for outgrew, I'll agree. Whether the orientation is the cause of all Western progress, -- you didn't define the term "progress". Just for now, I'll point out that the fruit is somewhat overripe--hence spectacles like DU, Jerry Springer, gender feminism, and the like.

The interplay between publically enforced mores, private convictions, and religious pluralism -- particularly in representative societies, as opposed to monarchical ones -- is a fascinating topic. But a bit too involved, even for a FReeper thread.

Cheers! Cheers!

49 posted on 10/28/2006 12:01:39 AM PDT by grey_whiskers
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To: grey_whiskers

Progress of the Western Civ is its surpassing other civilizations in all aspects of human existence - from public hygiene and health [where the Chinese held the lead prior to Renaissance - check Murray's "Human accomplishment"] to sci/ tech and military. And it happened when, and because of, the energies previously wasted on otherworldly pursuits were redirected into this world. In miniature you could see the same process with Ashkenasi Jews: when they were secularized and allowed to move from stetls and ghettoes - the progress was phenomenal, and phenomenally rapid, too.


51 posted on 10/28/2006 12:16:23 AM PDT by GSlob
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