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Major Baptist seminary rejects practice of speaking in tongues
Kansas City Star ^ | Oct. 17, 2006 | Brett Hoffman

Posted on 10/19/2006 5:44:54 PM PDT by split

FORT WORTH, Texas - After a Baptist pastor said in a chapel service at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary that he sometimes speaks in tongues when he prays, seminary trustees adopted a resolution Tuesday that states the institution will not tolerate the promotion of the practice of speaking in tongues.

The resolution: "Southwestern will not knowingly endorse in any way, advertise, or commend the conclusions of the contemporary charismatic movement including private prayer language. Neither will Southwestern knowingly employ professors or administrators who promote such practices."

Speaking in tongues is described in the Bible as a spiritual gift from God that empowers humans to speak in other languages. But many contemporary theologians teach that the practice was distinctly for first-century Christians. However, in the past century, Pentecostal and charismatic Christians have contended that speaking in tongues should be practiced in today's churches.

Patterson said he has consistently maintained a different view.

"I have opposed (speaking in tongues) for all of these years because I think it's an erroneous interpretation of the Bible," he said. "Southern Baptists traditionally have stood against what we feel like are the excesses of the charismatic movement. All we're doing is restating where we've always been."

Baptists are "the most intense advocates of religious liberty," Patterson said, defending the right of other Christians to believe in speaking in tongues. "But don't wear a Yankee uniform when you play for the Mets."

"We interpret the Scriptures in such a way that we do not see room for a private prayer language and we're saying we will not waver on that," Redmond said.

(Excerpt) Read more at kansascity.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: baptists; nopopesomanypopes; popehashismerits; religiousfreedom
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To: nmh
What denomination are you? It is surprising to find people who believe as you do. Nearly every denomination tolerates it in their midst, some more than others. The only ones I know who frown on it are this Southern Baptist group and Seventh Day Adventists. There may be some others I don't know about, maybe the Eastern Orthodox, can't think of any other denomination that doesn't have members involved in it. I've been researching and meditating on this for years, including the scriptures, but can't say that I have any corner on the truth.

I'm meeting more and more people associated with these kinds of churches and self-appointed "pastors". It wouldn't bother me in the least if they would leave me alone about religion. Some of them seem obsessed with it.

161 posted on 10/20/2006 6:41:34 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: nmh

HOW do you know speaking in tongues is from GOD? HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS, let alone WHAT they are saying when they "speak in tongues"? Me thinks you have a lot of explaining to do.
- - - -

Scripture is rather clear on that score . . .

that which; those who confess that Jesus came in the flesh; died; rose etc. are of God.

BTW, There's no twisting of St Paul's words at all. Just taking them plainly as he wrote them as edification for BELIEVERS.

NOT assuming, presuming and distorting them by inferences and extrapolations all out of whack.


162 posted on 10/20/2006 6:42:48 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: kittymyrib
According to Jesus, the Holy Spirit only tells you what Jesus has already taught. There are no new messages that the Spirit makes up on his own.

= = = =

Twisting and extrapolating as above is not edifying to me. Nor do I consider it Biblical.

Holy Spirit is often doing new things. It's sad that some folks miss out on them. But He's gearing up to participate with God in doing a LOT of new things in these END TIMES.

The perspective above makes Holy Spirit out to have gone fishing or sleeping once the Canon was closed . . . or was it several hundred years later after the Canon was decided on? Or has He merely reduced Himself to becoming a broken record on autoplay?

163 posted on 10/20/2006 6:46:55 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: phoenix0468

Wonderful testimony. Thanks.

And, right you are . . . none are so blind as those who will not see. And without an AUTHENTIC EXPERIENCE

AND/OR HOLY SPIRIT MOVING UPON THEM SUPERNATURALLY . . . they are unlikely to choose to see or allow Him to remove their blindness.


164 posted on 10/20/2006 6:48:30 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: wmfights

My perspective stated in response may have been a spring board to an amplification of a part of my perspective vs a specific reply to a specific stimulus.

Certainly, if the shoe doesn't fit, don't wear it. I tend to write only to those for whom the shoe fits.


165 posted on 10/20/2006 6:50:42 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

It is NOT the speaking of gibberish as some say and do today.
= = = =

St Paul disagrees. He spoke of speaking/praying WITH his understanding AND WITHOUT.

Of tongues of men

and tongues of angels.

Seems pretty clear, to me. Needing no off the wall extrapolations, assumptions and arbitrary inferences to derive Holy Spirit's meaning in Paul's words.


166 posted on 10/20/2006 6:52:22 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: phoenix0468

Please be sure you know whether your a cynic or a skeptic. One is a healthy thing and the other is not
= = = =

Excellent, discerning, perceptive, thoughtful, wise exhortation. Thanks.

I also think God often has as difficult or worse time with cynics than He does with fools.


167 posted on 10/20/2006 6:54:34 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: DarthVader

1Cor 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether [there be] prophecies, they shall fail; whether [there be] tongues, they shall cease; whether [there be] knowledge, it shall vanish away.


168 posted on 10/20/2006 6:56:41 PM PDT by tutstar (Baptist ping list-freepmail to get on or off)
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To: Quix
I never found he had anything very useful for my spiritual walk.

Of whom are you speaking when you say "he"?

169 posted on 10/20/2006 6:56:56 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: Quix

St Paul disagrees. He spoke of speaking/praying WITH his understanding AND WITHOUT.

Of tongues of men ( he was knowlegable in Greek, Hebbrew and Latin.)

and tongues of angels. (He was taken to the third heaven and heard other languages.)

Interesting that so-called tongues should disappear for 1900 years till revived at the Azuza St mission, then many jumped on the "me too! Me Too! bandwagon.
And sadly, too much fraud has acompanied it.


170 posted on 10/20/2006 7:11:20 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar ((Democrats have never found a fight they couldn't run from...Ann Coulter))
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To: Aliska

"Tongues of Men and Angels" by William J. Samarin, an anthropolgist, written from a linguistic approach, suggested reading.

And similar authors.


171 posted on 10/20/2006 7:16:32 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

Fraud abounds in all denominations. I've seen plenty.

But the gifts of The Spirit did not disappear for 1900 years. They clustered in a remnant during some decades but God always had a remnant that's been traceable by scholars.


172 posted on 10/20/2006 7:17:53 PM PDT by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Quix
So you dismiss entirely learned scholars or anything that will go against your notion of how things are or should be? Have you read the book? There aren't many, if any, quite like it.

I doubt if you'd find "Charisma of the Spirit in Search of a Supernatural Experience: A Journalist looks at the Tongues Movement", by Rene Noorbergen (Seventh Day Adventist) to your liking. It is an obscure little book, happened to be on the shelves of the public library, of all places, as well as Samarin's book and others. Samarin came across as being pretty objective and non-biassed, although I suspect he may not be an ardent believer in any form of Christianity, could be wrong about that.

I've got books in favor of tongues as well.

173 posted on 10/20/2006 7:33:48 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: Quix
***But the gifts of The Spirit did not disappear for 1900 years. They clustered in a remnant during some decades but God always had a remnant that's been traceable by scholars.***

I read an interesting book about 30 years ago. THESE ALSO SPEAK IN TONGUES. The author listed all the churches that he claimed spoke in tongues, but when he mentioned Mormons and Quakers I knew he didn't know what he was talking about.

Meanwhile, Paul has this excerpt to say...
1Cr 14:8 For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?

1Cr 14:9 So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air.

I have been to a Pentecostal church with people speaking in "tongues" and no one was translating the "gibberish". They were just opening their mouth and whatever came out came out.
About fifty years ago I met a man who had converted over from Pentecostalism to the church I went too. He said that he was told, in that Pentecostal church, that if he could not speak in tongues to just say "GLORY, GLORY, GLORY just as fast as he could.
He said there were several children sitting around saying "Glorygloryglory" just as fast as they could.
After the Baker,Swaggert,fiascos one man wrote a book about the frauds he perpetuated in the Assemblies of God church dealing with the "tongues" and "interpretation" of tongues.

1Cr 14:40 Let all things be done decently and in order.
174 posted on 10/20/2006 7:42:01 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar ((Democrats have never found a fight they couldn't run from...Ann Coulter))
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To: Quix

***Some folks that evening got gold fillings, others silver and others evidently white porcelain.***

There was a man I worked with. He had a mentally retarded daughter that his tongues and signs and wonders church claimed they would heal her with prayer. They prayed, prayed, prayed. Nothing happened.
So, they called on a bigger "healing" preacher to come and heal her. He came and prayed, prayed, prayed.

Nothing happened.

Because they could NOT heal her, he lost his faith and now is a full blown atheist.

Again, the tongues are merely people who speak foreign languages and need a translator.


175 posted on 10/20/2006 7:55:25 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar ((Democrats have never found a fight they couldn't run from...Ann Coulter))
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To: nmh
English suits me fine when communicating.

And God certainly understands that you are limited to such a primative language too.

176 posted on 10/20/2006 8:38:16 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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To: nmh
There's no need for it.

Says who? You?

Where does the Bible suggest we do it, TODAY? More specifically, where does it say we shouldn't?

177 posted on 10/20/2006 8:39:24 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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To: nmh
When tongues were used, they didn't have a BIBLE!!! BIG DIFFERENCE. Today we have all we need in the Bible.

Ah, but tongues ARE in the bible. And nowhere does the bible say they are one of the "don'ts". It very plainly says the exact opposite. You are picking and choosing based upon your own limited understanding.

178 posted on 10/20/2006 8:43:19 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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To: wmfights
What about the private prayer language, you and others have referred to, is it a language someone would recognize if it were written down?

I doubt anyone would or could understand it. The bible tells us that to speak in such a "prayer language" is edifying the spirit. I have always understood this somewhat along the lines of the "spirit bearing witness" as our spirit is bearing witness to the Holy Spirit who is dwelling within us.

179 posted on 10/20/2006 8:46:10 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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To: pamlet
"the Spirit himself intercedes with groans too deep for words" It doesn't say the Spirit GIVES the groans.. or the Spirit groans through you ... it says the "Spirit Himself intercedes"

Ah, but the Holy Spirit dwells within us. Could it not be a manifestation of Him "giving us the words to speak" in our prayer life?

180 posted on 10/20/2006 8:49:01 PM PDT by PleaseNoMore
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