Xzins,
Are the people arguing with you about Luke 21 trying to say that Jesus has already returned "in a cloud with power and great glory?"
Seems to me, they have to, if they think all of his prophesy there has to do with the generation of people extant at that time.
What may be true however, that this verse presents a transition, from an earlier prophesy, to a later one: "24and they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled."
The case could be made that before this statement, Jesus was speaking about times before "the times of the Gentiles" and afterward, he is speaking about the fulfillment of "the times of the Gentiles."
Sadly, preterists actually deal with this contradiction by saying that Jesus has already returned (secretly/symbolically, of course.) Unable to deal with this, semi-preterists back off of the return of Christ. However, as you point out it presents them with a dilemma. Jesus said all of these things will be fulfilled. If they insist on it mean that 33AD generation, then that mean Jesus has to have returned.
Does this look like heaven? (since they don't believe in a millennial reign.)
"Jerusalem will be trodden under foot of the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled."
It strikes me that that is still ongoing.
Therefore, THIS generation that sees ALL these things is based on Jesus speaking of that future era. He refers to the generation of the era about which he IS SPEAKING. And it's appropriate to say "THIS."
Luke 21 has already happened. The armies of Rome surrounded Jeruslem and destroyed the temple just as Jesus predicted. That is not in doubt by most Bible scholars.
"Again the high priest asked Him, saying to Him, "Are You the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?" Jesus said, 'I am. And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Power, and coming with the clouds of heaven.' " (Mark 14:61,62; cf. Matt. 26:64)
Philip Mauro remarks whether these signs are to be taken as literal or figurative:
In the first place, seeing we are debarred by the Lord's plain teaching from taking these commotions to be physical signs, visible to the eye, preceding and heralding His coming, or as having any special connection with that event, it would seem almost imperative that we give the words a figurative meaning. For it is not conceivable that, in speaking of this long age which was to be so full of important happenings, Christ would single out for mention nothing but a few isolated phenomena of nature in the physical heavens. This consideration practically compels us to find a meaning for the words which would make them descriptive of some distinguishing characteristic of the age, or at least of the latter part of it.I.e., it's not meant to be taken "literally".When we turn to Luke's account we find strong confirmation of this view. This confirmation appears in two particulars, first in the manner in which the reference to the sun, moon and stars is introduced; and second in the fact that it is directly coupled with certain general characteristics of the age, such as we should expect in a brief utterance of this kind. For Luke gives it thus (we put the salient part in italics):
For there shall be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations; and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars, and upon the earth distress of nations with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring: Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth; for the powers of heaven shall be shaken (#Lu 21:23-26).
According to this account the Lord does not break off His predictions abruptly at the capture and destruction of Jerusalem, but follows the Jews in their dispersion unto all nations, and also foretells the treading down of Jerusalem by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. Thus we are carried into the period which follows after the tribulation of those days, and are informed that that period is divinely designated the times of the Gentiles. {1} And now immediately follows (in Luke's account) the passage we are examining, And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. But here we have also the further statement, and on the earth distress of nations with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring, men's hearts failing them, etc. From these words it is clear that the Lord is giving (which, as we have pointed out, is what we should expect) some very broad and general characteristics of our age, with an eye especially upon the closing part thereof. Moreover, in speaking of the unsettled state of the nations He uses a familiar figurative expression, namely, the sea and the waves roaring. This figure represents the turbulence of the peoples of the earth (see #Re 17:15, Isa 8:7), just as the sun, moon and stars represent rulership, governments, and authorities. Thus we find good reason for concluding that the Lord is here speaking figuratively of unusual happenings in the political firmament, that is to say, in the sphere of governments, or what Paul calls the higher powers (#Ro 13:1).
In Isaiah 13:7-10 (#Isa 13:7-10) we have an example of the use of this figure. It occurs in connection with a description of the day of the Lord. We quote verse 10: For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light; the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine. Taking these words in connection with Genesis 1:16-18, (#Ge 1:16-18) and with Joseph's dream about the sun, moon and stars (which his father and brethren had no need of one to interpret for them, (#Ge 37:9,10), and in connection also with (#Eze 32:7 Joe 2:31, 3:15 Re 12:1,) we get the idea that the sun stands for authority on earth in the broadest sense, and the moon for lesser authority, and the stars for prominent persons in the sphere of government.
Are the people arguing with you about Luke 21 trying to say that Jesus has already returned "in a cloud with power and great glory?"
Seems to me, they have to, if they think all of his prophesy there has to do with the generation of people extant at that time.
= = = = = =
DON'T YOU KNOW????
DIDN'T YOU GET THE MEMO???
Were you LEFT BEHIND????
OF COURSE JESUS RETURNED IN GREAT POWER AND GLORY in 33.2 AD.
Of course He had to transmorgify into a tiny little gnome to fit inside the narrow, rigid, tidy little boxes of the CONTRARIAN REPLACEMENTARIANS . . . but that was fine with them. They just stuffed Him in his tidy little box at the foot of Calvin's casket and have pontificated on a plenty as though nothing happened.