Posted on 09/01/2006 5:32:18 AM PDT by xzins
The next major event is the actual, real bodily second coming of Jesus (not to be confused with the partial bodily second coming seven years earlier). Jesus "touched down" on the Mount of Olives and makes His way over to the temple mount area where He may or may not find a temple. There He will either a) rebuild the temple, or b) enter the temple that has already been rebuilt during the seven year tribulation (again, depending on which dispensationalist you follow). He also needs to locate the actual but long missing "throne of David" so He can sit down.
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More mangled, twisted, wholesale distorted rubber Bible notions.
I don't think Scripture is at all clear about what happens to the rebuilt THIRD TEMPLE over the process of The Great Tribulation. It's plausible it won't be ultimately needed at all because of Christ and because of The New Jerusalem coming down out of Heaven.
Nevertheless, THE THIRD TEMPLE was NOT REBUILT IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE DESTRUCTION OF THE 2ND ONE IN AD70.--ANOTHER PROOF that the Biblical END TIMES prophecies were NOT fulfilled at all in 70AD.
Someone ought to be keeping track of all these rather conclusive proofs of that.
He needs to locate the actual but long missing "throne of David" so He can judge the nations.
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HE NEVER LOST IT. He knows exactly where it is along with the Ark of The Covenant.
Given His hobby/penchant for the authentic and the real, I would expect Him to sit on the real former throne of David . . . but, hey, He's God, He can do what He wants consistent with His Nature and Word.
Jesus institutes the "thousand years" on earth where He physically sits in the temple in Jerusalem on David's literal throne conducting animal sacrifices.
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More mangled RUBBER BIBLE nonsense notions.
I don't recall a single Scripture even hinting that Jesus will offer animal sacrifices. There are some real mysteries about animal sacrifices in the prophetic Scriptures but I don't recall a single even hint of Jesus carrying out such.
At the end of the "thousand years" the offspring of the unresurrected folks will rebel against Christ at the second battle of God and Magog.
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The extremely cryptic Scriptures about the end of the thousand years, imho, do not support great emphatic pontifications by anyone on any side.
There is yet another resurrection, judgment, etc and then comes the eternal state with the new Jerusalem coming down from heaven (or perhaps it was already was on the earth, again depending on which dispensationalist you follow).
How did I do?
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The details about the end of the 1,000 years of Perfect Peace are thick with hidden mystery. Pontifications about that time at all are rather vain, arrogant and absurd on any side of the issues.
. . . . about the question . . . characteristically rubber Bible manglingly absurdly . . . are the words that most come to mind.
Certainly folks on one side seem as irrational and goofy in some of their behavior as the rock throwing, derisive, dismissive folks on the other side.
Who'd a thunk! Humans!
So so tell, what abomination do these two-thirds of the Jews commit that God would exterminate them in the great futurist holocaust?
Does not 2/3rds of the entire earth die in this holocaust ?
Does not Jesus say that ... "If He had not shortened the days', ... there would have been no flesh saved" ?Matthew 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.It's not 2/3 of Israel, it's a 100% of all mortal, physical life, is doomed to die.
...
24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Yes, but these two-thirds are singled out for a reason to die. If you die in your sleep, that is one thing. Their death is hardly "natural".
Why do you pick against the implications of this theology plainly taught by a generation of futurist dispensationalists without apology?
Death is death.
All men (and women) die.
Some die sooner, some die later.Luke 13:4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?
Futurist "last days" are not the same as biblical "last days".
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In the evident context of the meaning of those words above in this thread . . .
I'd have to say . . . nonsense. My Bible is like reading today's news on these END TIMES prophetic Scripture issues and topics.
I realize rubber Bibles vary considerably on the other side.
Also as a sidenote, IMHO, those who reject Christ because there is death and misery and horrors on earth are having a spiritual temper tantrum - they want perfection now - skip to the last few chapters of Revelation.
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Excellent Spirit anointed insight and truth, imho.
Thanks.
No biggy. You can bet I'll be reading your every word on such threads . . . and usually quite prayerfully--though typically more rejoicing prayers than pondering prayers.
" We report. You decide."
You are a Calvinist. Did God plan for those 6 million to be murdered by Fascism?
You're a smart fellow so I will explain the difference. Some others may not get it, but I know you will.
Theologians generally differentiate between the secret or decretive will of God and the revealed or prescriptive will of God. The former is know only to God while the latter can be known to all men through God's special revelation, e.g., the Bible.
God nowhere in the Bible predicted the slaughter of six million Jews at the hands of the Nazis. God nowhere predicted that the Second World War would occur in the 20th century (unless you are reading the Nostradamus version). So God nowhere tells us the reason why in His sovereign plan six million Jews died in the Nazi holocaust (other than the overarching fact of man's total degenerated sinfulness).
Now, one the other hand, your futurist dispensationalist friends turn to the very pages of the Bible to find a prediction and details about the futurist holocaust. It's right there in Zechariah 13 according to such dispensationalist giants as John Walvoord:
The purge of Israel in their time of trouble is described by Zechariah in these words: ‘And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith Jehovah, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein. And I will bring the third part into the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried’ (Zechariah 13:8, 9). According to Zechariah’s prophecy, two thirds of the children of Israel in the land will perish, but the one third that are left will be refined and be awaiting the deliverance of God at the second coming of Christ which is described in the next chapter of Zechariah (Israel in Prophecy).Now, if one actually takes the time to read the context of Zech. 13:8,9 you will see that the two-thirds are cut off for idolatry and speaking words of false prophecy (vv. 2,3).
God is explicitly punishing Israel for these particular sins. And it is a great judgment.
So, putting two and two together, one sees that futurist Israel in the land must be a hotbed of idolatry and false prophecy and God, as punishment, kills off two-thirds of that generation, but brings the one-third "remnant" though it all as by fire.
The bottom line is that WWII holocaust slaughter is a matter of God's secret will. No one talked about six million dead by 1945 in the 1800s based on specific Bible verses, or why it might happen from the Bible.
But the futurist holocaust of two-thirds of Israel is, by definition, a matter of God's revealed will, otherwise we would not be talking about it before the fact.
See the difference?
Point #2 - there is a way to reconcile these as one, because post-trib dispensationalist folks do so. The rapture would happen during Jesus' descent to touch down on Mt of Olives.
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Personally, that's just far, far, far too much of a jury rigged/ shoe horned silly notion to me.
But, yeah, I believe that it's reasonable on cryptic mysterious Scriptures to have more than one plausible interpretation.
It's NOT very reasonable to pretend that a LIST of unfulfilled END TIMES SCRIPTURES that didn't have any remote hint of a fulfillment in 70Ad were totally fulfilled.
I don't know what alternate reality such notions crawled out of but it couldn't have been very . . . kosher.
Let's face it -- the thing driving the sales of "prophecy" books is the vivid descriptions of exciting events to come, most of which involve horrendous suffering for a lot of people (present company not included, of course!)
How tedious, mundane, and routine must the post-mil vision appear by contrast. No apocalyptic thrill rides -- just a world filled with faithful people pursuing their vocations, raising their families, and inviting their neighbors one by one to join in the ongoing party. A growing percentage of the world's population receiving the gift of saving faith, and raising happier families. And, at the end of the best we can do, our own deaths.
Well, there is the excitement of seeing God take down His enemies by unexpected means. Happy Hal, recylcer of books and marriages (same plots, new faces), never predicted the fall of Soviet communism. Post-mil folks, OTOH, anticipate the discrediting of Islam, and ponder preparations for ministering to post-muslim millions.
Well, accolades to A-G aside which I'm sure are well-deserved, please do.
Thankfully, we know from Scripture that all these dire predictions are a myth.
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DING DING DING BUZZZZT! WRONG.
WE know that some folks treat some Scriptural truths as a myth.
Does NOT MAKE said Scriptural truths a myth, however.
WELL SAID, imho.
AMEN to the max!
I know a lot of dispensationalist believers who take quite seriously the Scriptures about avoiding rejoicing when one's enemy falls.
I can believe that folks on the other side are not so concerned about obeying said Scripture.
Later y'all. Off to pastor's lunch . . . with his whole family today. The kids like to go to "Quix's" place . . . aka Furrs Cafeteria.
I cannot pick out from it, though, your answer to the question, "Is God culpable for the murder of those 6 million Jews?"
What would you reply?
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