Mary a Meeting Point of Cultures, Says Muslim - Encourages Pilgrimages to Marian Shrines

Zenit News Agency ^ | June 29, 2006

[NYer]

Missionaries in the future will, more and more, see that their apostolate among the Muslims will be successful in the measure that they preach Our Lady of Fatima. Mary is the advent of Christ, bringing Christ to the people before Christ himself is born. In an apologetic endeavor, it is always best to start with that which people already accept. Because the Muslims have a devotion to Mary, our missionaries should be satisfied merely to expand and to develop that devotion, with the full realization that Our Blessed Lady will carry the Muslims the rest of the way to her divine Son. She is forever a "traitor," in the sense that she will not accept any devotion for herself, but will always bring anyone who is devoted to her to her divine Son. As those who lose devotion to her lose belief in the divinity of Christ, so those who intensify devotion to her gradually acquire that belief.

Mary and the Muslims

[nmh]

Leave it to Muslim to use "Mary" just another sinner as the common ground. Heck you can pray right along with Muslims to Mary. I won't be praying to Mary anytime soon.

[nmh]

"The journalist said that he is convinced that the Virgin Mary is a meeting point between Christians and Muslims."

Ahem, a meeting point between Catholics and Muslims.

[Sonny M]

Are the muslims going to ask christians to throw stones at her?

Does anyone here see the irony of the fact that if Islam had been around at the same time as Mary, they would have killed her?

[MJG]

Mary anytime soon.

Why not? You'll ask some schlep on FR or at your church to pray for you, why not the mother of your Lord Christ?

[rogator]

"Ahem, a meeting point between Catholics and Muslims."

Ahem, a meeting point between Catholic Christians, Orthodox Christians, many Protestant Christians, and Muslims.

[bonfire]

The meeting point is Jesus. Remember him??

[NYer]

Leave it to Muslim to use "Mary" just another sinner as the common ground.

Dear christian friend .... puhlease! ... Mary was immaculately conceived.

Mary's sinlessness is not for her own sake, but for Jesus' sake.  She had to be holy in order to be a worthy vessel for her utterly holy Son.  So this doctrine upholds the holiness and deity of Christ.

Since Jesus Himself preserved her, Mary's sinlessness depends completely upon Him.  He is the Savior of all humanity, Mary included.  By preserving her from all sin, Jesus shows us that He can indeed save "to the uttermost" (Hebrews 7:25).

[ladyinred]

I am sorry , but I find all of this appalling.

[NYer]

The meeting point is Jesus. Remember him??

The Muslims view Jesus as a prophet and nothing less. However, they hold a deep devotion to His mother. Mary's role in redemption is to lead ALL souls to her Son. Get the Muslims to see Mary's role and you've conquered their religious beliefs. It's really just that simple.

[NYer]

I am sorry , but I find all of this appalling.

How so? Mary's role in redemption is to lead ALL men to her Son. Click on the above link and read that article. Perhaps it will put things into perspective.

[FJ290]

"Mary is a figure present in the Koran, which dedicates an entire sura [chapter ed.n.] to her and mentions her some thirty times. In Muslim countries there are Marian shrines that are the object of veneration and pilgrimage by Christian and Muslim faithful," he said.

As a Catholic I fail to see how they are respectful to Mary when they disrespect her Son by saying He's not Divine, He's not the Son of God.

Is this how they honor and venerate Mary? The Women:

[4.171] O followers of the Book! do not exceed the limits in your religion, and do not speak (lies) against Allah, but (speak) the truth; the Messiah, Isa son of Marium is only an apostle of Allah and His Word which He communicated to Marium and a spirit from Him; believe therefore in Allah and His apostles, and say not, Three. Desist, it is better for you; Allah is only one God; far be It from His glory that He should have a son, whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His, and Allah is sufficient for a Protector.

This one from The Women really rankles me:

4.157] And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Isa son of Marium, the apostle of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so (like Isa) and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure.

How does that honor her? Denying that Jesus was crucified! She whose heart was pierced with sorrow as she watched her Son being crucified. I think they do a great disservice to Mary actually.

If they had any honor or respect for her, they would be following her Son.

[MJG]

I am sorry , but I find all of this appalling

It's appalling to you because you don't believe that God is infinite. You like many other Protestants believe that God chose Mary as Mother of the Word Incarnate, Christ claimed Mary as His mother (and stated as such), yet somehow in heaven she is relegated to some second class status, as if she was simply used and discarded like a disposable vessel.

That simply doesn't resolve.

Christ's word is infinite, on earth as it is in heaven. As it was in the beginning it is now - unchanging. Mother MEANS mother and God's kingdom is heaven AND earth. Although we can't see heaven, there is no distinction to the almighty - Mary is no less now than she ever was.

[rogator]

Sure do.
There are several meeting points between us and the Muslims.
Belief in God being the most basic.

[Piers-the-Ploughman]

Thankfully this exercise in wishful thinking is coming not from the Church but from laity whose credentials in matters of faith are completely unknown to us yet are presented as reasonable.

If ever approved at Church level, its garbage like this that leads to ecumenical fiascos like Assisi as heretics in local churches use these dialogs as excuses to bring an imam in to preach at a Catholic homily (oops, renamed "reflection", so no rules are broken), then Mohammed's statue is placed next to Mary's, etc, and we're all invited to the local mosque for services.

Keeping lines of communication is always important as is mutual respect, they too are made in God's image, and by all means work with them on pro-life issues at the UN, anything beyond natural law issues is Wilsonian or a Teilhard de Chardin-like fantasy.

The only level at which I see a practical value to our Church leaders meeting with other Church leaders is the Orthodox. All other Christians are too far from us to be negogiated with and papered over without us diluting the truth. These souls will be won over only by prayer, fasting, and our best example.

[blue-duncan]

"Mary's role in redemption is to lead ALL souls to her Son"

Mary's role in redemption is to be saved just as all sinners are saved by trusting Christ for her salvation. She is dead now and serves no useful purpose to those on earth except for her role historically as the mother of Jesus. It is the job of the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ as the scriptures tell us,

Jhn 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, [even] the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning."


Jhn 16:7 "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come,
he will reprove the world of sin, and
of righteousness, and
of judgment:

Of sin, because they believe not on me;
Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

Jhn 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew [it] unto you. All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew [it] unto you."

No where in scripture does it say Mary has any other role in redemption other than that of Jesus' mother. We all have as much a role in redemption as she did by witnessing to the saving power of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus as the all sufficient satisfaction for sin.

[rogator]

" Keeping lines of communication is always important as is mutual respect, they too are made in God's image,...."

It doesn't hurt to acknowledge that respect for or veneration of Mary is common to Muslims and most Christians.
I share your feelings regarding the Assisi fiasco and other such activities.
I do not see visiting the cathedral of St. Sophia in Constantinople (Istanbul)or the Alhambra as neccessarily a bad thing.

[rogator]

"Mary's role in redemption is to be saved just as all sinners are saved by trusting Christ for her salvation. She is dead now and serves no useful purpose to those on earth except for her role historically as the mother of Jesus."

I am sure glad we have you around to tell us the proper role of the Mother of God.

However, you might want to know that the vast majority of Christians living and dead might not agree with you.

[Pyro7480]

Mary's role in redemption is to be saved just as all sinners are saved by trusting Christ for her salvation. She is dead now and serves no useful purpose to those on earth except for her role historically as the mother of Jesus.

The book of Revelation is pretty clear about the saints being in Heaven.