Posted on 06/22/2006 7:36:40 AM PDT by Pyro7480
Sooner or later the debate always ends with the labels.
Why didn't we just surrender to the Nazis and promote democracy in secret when we wasted all those lives? If God doesn't want us to die for our faith, why should my government ask me to die for my nation?
Relativism, is reality. Isn't what you believe to be true, relative to your religious beliefs, as are others? Is what a Hindu believes to be true, the same as what a Jewish person believes to be true?
As I said, I understand laying down one's life for a friend or loved one, to keep them from physical harm....this is not the same as laying down one's life for a belief.
I know, it's inevitable.....but amusing.
War and invasion, results in physical harm....not the same as dying for a belief.
So all those that died in the American Revolution were just chumps?
What a sad, empty world you live in, where there's no real truth, nothing more compelling that opinion, and nothing worth dying for.
By the way, does it ever occur to you that your philosophical platitudes, like this one:
The difference between right and wrong, are completely dependent on the individuals involved.
... are just as unprovable and just as much a matter of personal opinion as you claim ours are ... if not more so? Go ahead, prove to me that "the difference between right and wrong (etc.)." You can't. I do know that men much smarter than either you or I (Thomas Aquinas and J. Budziszewski are two I can think of off the top of my head) have used a lot of ink arguing against your position.
Except that ours aren't just opinion.
You know, in Fatima, Portugal, in 1917, a miracle occurred in which the sun appeared to dance in the sky and then hurtle toward the earth. 70,000 people witnessed the miracle in person. It was seen as far away as the Azores. It was reported in secular newspapers in Portugal the next day.
That's not a matter of opinion, but of verifiable historical fact.
Not necessarily. In the traditional rules of warfare, surrender mitigates destruction. If we surrendered to the Nazis, D-Day would never have occurred.
Relativism is chaos. If there is order in the universe, there has to be universal truth, not relative truth. If I stop believing you exist, do you stop existing?
I would think that establishing a new nation and and revolting against the king, are more physical, and a lot more than a religious belief.
You are correct, in that I do not believe that a religious belief, or an intangible idea, is worth dying over.
As I have said, defending/protecting loved one's or one's country, is not the same.
Of course it has occured to me, that is why I always say that none of this is provable....it's all a matter of belief.
Miracle...or phenomena? Thousands have seen UFOs also. Prove any of them.
But we would have physically lost our land....not at all like a religious belief.
If the shoe fits... Not really. God is.... whether we can prove it or not.
To an atheist, it's just an opinion, not a fact. In which case, according to the relativist, the atheist is equally correct.
Society seems better without homosexuality.
Since people have differing views, the opposite must be true as well.
I know you can't. Be that as it may, did somebody (stuart) say a child in the womb is not a person? I must have missed it. Matter of fact, I read where he's ok with fighting for his family.
You're unclear on the concept. The point is, it doesn't matter what you or anyone else thinks if there's no universal truth.
Speak for yourself (the p--sy part of it that is)
Actually, I was addressing you but forgot the ping.
I think we'd all die for certain principles.
But that's just dumb.
So you've added "real estate" to "family" as things worth dying for?
he died rather than compromise his beliefs. St. John Fisher was required to swear an oath of loyalty to Henry the VIII as head of the Catholic Church in England. He refused and Henry killed him.
I too would rather die than betray my faith, and in doing so, betray my Lord.
"So it's better to die, and never be able to express your beliefs, even in secret and maybe bring others to your way of thinking, than it is to bow to some stupid city, say praise allah, and continue on believing as you did?"
What's the point of faith, if you are unwilling to embrace it fully? I will die before I ever, even in appearance only, worship the false god allah the the man Muhammed. God required His only Son to lay down His life, there is a chance He will require the same of others.
This is not the same as a religious belief that is relative to the individual.
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